Oh, fuck 'em. Of course you can pass as an uncle.
You're a great performer. I'm a great director. Together we can
do almost anything. Oh, Armand, really? Absolutely. Oh.
We've got 5 hours. All right, first, get your pinky down.
It's up again. All right, and your pacha—
Oh my God, are you crazy? What are you doing?
Stop screaming. I'm teaching you to act like a man. All right.
All right. Now, this is a dinner party.
Let's work with food. All right? Spread some mustard
on the toast. Don't use the
spoon, and don't dribble little dots of mustard. No? No. You take your knife and
you smear. Men smear.
Smear. That's it. Yeah. Yeah. All right.
Get the goddamn pinky down! All right, make your fingers like iron. All right,
yeah, and stop trembling. Hold the knife boldly.
Yes! Oh God, I pierced the toast!
It's 2 Dads 1 Movie. It's the podcast where 2 middle-aged
dads sit around and shoot the shit about the movies of the '80s and '90s.
Here are your hosts, Steve Paulo and Nic Briana.
Hello, everybody. Welcome to another episode of 2 Dads, 1 Movie. I'm Steve.
And I'm Nic. And today we have gone to South Beach in
the mid-'90s, and we are watching the comedy classic
The Birdcage, based off the play La Cage aux Folles
by Jean Poiret and starring Robin Williams and Nathan Lane. This is
one that I brought to us, and I'll be honest, it's because it is one
of my favorite movies of all time. This is a movie that my wife and
I, like, continue to quote to each other. It's one that I saw first in
high school. Um, I was in theater. Uh, this seemed like a
big movie with theater kids. I feel like, yeah, for whatever reason, maybe because it
was based on a play— not that I like saw the play or anything,
but, uh, you know, it just— But the world of it too.
Yeah, like, the producers of a performance and all that stuff. Being in
'96, being a very, very queer-friendly, gay-friendly kind of concept, and, and,
and, and, you know, the play being centered around like that
identity, I think also is a thing that maybe like some elements of mainstream audiences
kind of would be like, meh, but like theater kids in particular were sort of
in tune with, you know, I think the first few kids I knew growing up
who came out of the closet were theater people, you know, just in general.
And so yeah, this really hit in that sense for me, but it's just so
funny. And this was my first real kind of like understanding of who Nathan Lane
is. Obviously he was the voice of Timon a few years earlier in The Lion
King, but like, you know, you don't see him if he's animating or voicing an
animated character. Right. He is, Goddamn comedy genius, I think, Nathan Lane.
So very, very happy with The Birdcage. Uh, Nic, was this one
that you'd seen before? Never seen it before. Yeah, so, uh, and it—
you know, I like Robin Williams a lot. Obviously, who doesn't? If you find someone
who says, yeah, I don't like Robin Williams, like, fuck out of here, man.
Go live in Antarctica, do some research. Clear red flag. Go find The
Thing. Yeah. Um, but yeah, so I
don't know, this just got by me. And not being in theater, uh,
you know, I didn't have the same kind of circles and wasn't being shown the
same stuff. And then at a certain point in my life, and I think I've
talked about this before, like late '90s, early 2000s, I only watched
like action movies and stuff. Like I had the most garbage,
like the equivalent of a fast food diet of films for like
a big stretch of my life. So a lot of this stuff missed me for
a long time. And I got back into these types of movies maybe the last
like 10 years. But, uh, yeah, I'd never seen this one before. So. Okay.
I heard a lot about it. I know a lot of people are big fans
of it, so, uh, always down to see some Bobby Williams. Yeah, absolutely. Bobby.
I don't know if I've ever heard him called Bobby. I know. I like that.
No, I think you should stick with that. That should be your thing. From now
on, he's Bobby to you. I like that. Um, all right, let's jump into the
facts on The Birdcage. Uh, the movie The Birdcage was released
on March 8th, 1996 with an R rating and a running time of 117 minutes.
It was directed by Mike Nichols, and the screenplay was written by Elaine May and
based, as I said, on the play by Jean Poiret. It stars Robin Williams,
Gene Hackman, and Nathan Lane. Scores on Rotten Tomatoes, a really healthy
85%. On IMDb, slightly like lower kind
of in comparison, 7.3. Not quite as popular on IMDb.
We get a thumbs down from the schmuck Gene Siskel and a thumbs up from
the homie Roger Ebert. Awards, quite a bit of award activity actually
on this one. So we have an Oscar nomination in '97
for art direction. It didn't win, but I mean, yeah, really stunning sets and the
way things are decorated. Yeah, visually, like capturing that like South Beach, Miami kind
of feeling, the colors and the vibrance. of it was really nice. Also, whoever did
the costumes, there were more thongs in this movie than maybe any movie ever created.
Very interesting. It won a couple of awards at the 1997
Blockbuster Awards, which we have to remind ourselves every once in a while were
a thing that existed. That's right. Gene Hackman and Dianne
Wiest won the Best Supporting Actor and Best Supporting Actress awards at Blockbuster
for this. In '97 at the Golden Globes, we got nominations
for Best Comedy Picture and for Best Actor in a Comedy for
Nathan Lane. No wins there though. In the 1997 MTV Movie Awards, It was nominated
for the Best On-Screen Duo for Robin Williams and Nathan Lane,
and Best Comedic Performance for Robin Williams, but also no wins there. Yeah. One other
kind of, yeah, I don't know about major, but larger award win at
the '97 SAG Awards, or the Screen Actors Guild, now called the Actors Awards,
the entire cast won Outstanding Performance by a Cast. Okay. So sort of a
joint award there. On a $31 million budget, they pulled
in $185.3 million at the box office for just
under 6 times what it cost to make. And again, for an R-rated movie that's
not like a thriller or an action movie or
whatever. That's actually pretty impressive, I think, for sort of an R-rated comedy, uh,
to pull in that kind of money. Not— yeah, for sure. Not being like a
Terminator 2 type thing. Yeah, I think I looked up like the highest
grossing R-rated movies of the '90s, and basically across the board it was like action
movies and Basic Instinct. That was basically it.
So, and this movie makes a lot of sense. None of those tones really.
So, all right, so let's jump into the actual film,
The Birdcage. We start off with South Beach, Miami,
Florida. Zooming in over the water, we get the whole kind of vibe of like,
you know, Ocean Boulevard there in South Beach. All the clubs,
neon signs, people walking around dressed in very little clothing, a lot of
bathing suits, a lot of thongs. As I said, men and women, plenty of thongs.
Um, we zoom in on the Birdcage, which is the name of a
nightclub, and on the outside it says, uh, Armond Goldman presents Starina
and the Goldman Girls. And this is a, uh, Not Golden Girls, but Golden
Girls. I thought it was cute. Uh, this is a drag club. They're, they're a
drag show. Um, so we head inside along with some customers, and we're just getting
like a vibe, getting like the feel for the place. Uh, and it's a cool
shot, like where it kind of flies across the water, like to the front of
the club, and then right inside. And then seamlessly kind of we're now following people
in rather than flying, right? Which is very neat. Good, good, good editing there.
And then, uh, we're quickly— we see, uh, Robin Williams' character Armond Goldman,
and he is clearly the club's owner. I mean, his name's on the you know,
marquee, but also like he's kind of checking on everything. He's talking to the host
and he's talking to the bartender and he's kind of making sure everything's in place
and all this stuff. And, uh, a waiter comes up to him and says,
you know, uh, the Kennedys are here for, you know, 3rd time this week.
You want to pick up their, uh, tab? And he goes, is it— what does
he say? Is it Teddy? And he goes, no, it's the younger ones. I wish
we could get Teddy. You know, it's funny, A, to want Teddy Kennedy anywhere is,
is— Right, right. Odd. But then I thought to myself, the younger ones. So is
this like RFK Jr.? RFK Jr. absolutely is there, dude. And I think
he was served the free coffee that screwed up his voice forever. That must be
it. Yeah. Yeah. And I asked for green tea,
like, oh my God, that or it was snorting all the cocaine off the toilet
seats. That was prime drug time for sure. Yeah. So that was definitely something
I wrote down where I was like, oh, that was RFK Jr. era. Imagine what
a nightmare that guy was in his like mid-30s or whatever. Oh man.
Yeah. So, but it is funny how Albert's just like, all right, well, it's not
Ted, then they get free coffee. Yeah. I also think I want to point out
here that like Armand is wearing throughout
most of this movie, but certainly they're very obvious in this, in this opening scene,
what I think look like the most comfortable pair of pants that have ever existed.
Like, I don't think I could pull them off because they're really flowy and whatever,
but they look so comfortable. Like, in the heat in Florida, flowy linen
pants. He has some outfits in this movie where I am just like, dude,
my, my buttons feel tighter just looking at him. Like, even though I'm not wearing
anything tight, it just seems so comfortable to live in. I may not be able
to go out in it, but I would absolutely lounge around my house wearing that.
For sure. Like, for sure. Oh man. So, so they're, so they're
telling him like they're, they're kind of in this performance, this We Are Family performance,
and, uh, coming up is Starina. Like, Starina's on in 5,
and Starina is the Nathan Lane, the character that Nathan Lane's character Albert
plays. Exactly, right on stage. Um, and you know,
Albert is having a bit of a meltdown like leading up to this. Yeah.
And so, so Armond runs upstairs to like see what's going on, and Albert like
locks himself in his dressing room, I guess. He's got, you know, like a room
there because it's like their apartment basically is like above. Yeah, the club and
their apartment. It took me a minute to figure out the geography of this until
I realized, okay, that like they live right upstairs. And they've even got like a
little rooftop pool. Yeah, it's a really nice place. Yeah. Um, but, uh, Hank Azaria
plays their maid or, or, you know, houseman or whatever. Uh, uh,
Agador. Uh, Guatemalan thick accent. Hank Azaria looks
great in this. He's obviously Like he looks ripped. Like I don't ever remember him
necessarily being a dude who's ripped, but he's like jacked in this movie.
He's always— what was the one where he was like the scuba instructor
guy? I feel like there's a few movies where it's like, whoa, dude, what the
hell? You can't be able to do every voice and be able to do like
one-arm push-ups on your pinkies. Are you for scuba? Like, yeah, yeah, yeah.
But basically, like, Armand is trying to like knock down
the door because Albert's refusing to come out. He finally does actually bust down
the door, and it's just a lot of chaos. I do love a line in
here where Albert finally agrees, 'cause they're gonna say, oh, well, we'll put on so-and-so,
some other actor to be Starina. And Albert's like, no, like, the people came to
see Starina, you know? And he's like, kind of like, okay, fine, I'll do it.
And but he goes to Agador, Agador, I need some Pyrin tablets, please. And Armand's
like, well, what the fuck? What are you— what, you giving her drugs? You're giving
him drugs? What the fuck is going on? And Agador's like, it's Asparin with the
A and the S scraped off. Oh, that's brilliant. Like, let him think it's something
else. Good gag there, for sure. Um,
Let's see. Oh, so so he finally
agrees, and like kind of under the threat of okay, well we'll let somebody else
do it. And that's like it's it's funny kind of throughout
this film how the characters all know what the other person's limit actually
is. Right. Like so they're able to call each other's bluffs pretty accurately.
Yeah. Like throughout this movie with his son and like you know all this other
stuff. That's a good point. So yeah, so Albert just finally agrees
to go on. Right. But then. Armand is—
he's got things to do, right? He's meeting somebody, and Albert is like suspicious because
he said that, well, why did it— you know, is there another man? Because they're
going through a breakup. It's kind of hinting at this. Well, it's right. I think
it's more just Albert's just really, um,
like, what's the term, like, like not very confident, like lacking in self-confidence in their
relationship. And he says like, there's white wine in the fridge. Yeah, I only drink
red. You only drink red. And Armand's like trying to play it off, and he's
like, you know, oh, I switched to white because red has tannins. Albert's not buying
it. Correct. Well, yes, absolutely. I just wanted to make sure the wine stuff was
factually correct. Tannins come from contact with the skins of the grapes.
Oh, okay. And you don't generally get very much skin contact in white wine.
You get a little tiny bit in rosé wine and then a lot in red
wine to get the coloring. That's where all the pigment lives and that's where the
tannins come from. And tannins also, if you've ever had old tea,
like you make a hot tea and then it gets cold and it kind of
whatever, and then you taste it and it's extra bitter. Yeah, yeah. That's tannin.
That's literally the same thing. It's like plant material like basically does that. So a
little education for everybody. But yeah, I love there's a moment where Uh, uh,
Albert is like on top of Armand, is like knocking, he's like, hit me,
you wanna hit me, don't you? And he goes, he's like, and he checks his
watch to see how much time he has left, and then he pushes him by
the face off of him. Um, but basically like Armand is meeting somebody,
and so he goes back upstairs, tells Agador to take the night off.
Agador's dancing to Gloria Estefan. Yeah. Uh, and there's this
point where he, he takes the, the, the radio or whatever and goes, come on,
Gloria. And that's something my wife Heather and I still say to each other all
the time. For— we find ways to fit come on, Gloria into
as much of our conversation as possible. Um, nice. But sure enough, he gives Agador
the night off. So it's like, you know, we're right with Albert here, led to
believe Armand is, is stepping out. Right, because he doesn't give any information or whatever.
Um, but it turns out— yeah, so, so somebody comes in, younger looking guy,
handsome guy. And I don't know if I just got this wrong the first time,
but I feel like they're leaving it very up in the air. Like the way
that they greet each other, I was still just like, yeah, okay, this is like
the other guy, right? Um, and, and it's kind of set
up that way, and there's a lot of conversation. Yeah. Uh,
before it's revealed that this is Val, this is their son. Yes. Right. Well,
this is, this is specifically Armand's biological son, but I think Albert has been in
his life for like mo— his whole life, for most of his life. Exactly.
Absolutely. Um, this guy sucks ass.
I don't like the actor. I don't like the character. Yep. Uh,
I was just like, I can't say— he has that kind of like John Mulaney
face where his eyes seem to be drifting further apart from each other over time.
time. Um, and I like John Mulaney, but, uh, yeah, this guy
was killing me the whole time. It should come as no surprise that basically everybody
else in this cast is, you know, at this point was
already famous, right? Or became quite famous after
the fact. Because you have, you have Robin Williams, Nathan Lane, Gene Hackman.
That's sort of your top billing, right? All, you know, Nathan Lane, this was near
the beginning. This was before he did The Producers. This is like near the beginning
of his like stardom. But like Huge star, right? Gene Hackman, Robin Williams,
massive, massive stars. Diane Wiest, massive star. Hank Azaria, you know,
better known for voice work pre-this, but like— but he's been steadily
involved in stuff. Absolutely doing stuff. Calista Flockhart, I think pretty unknown here, but then
became Ally McBeal, and like, you know, that's a huge thing. Christine Baranski is a
fucking goddamn treasure, and she's in a big chunk of this. And then
there's this guy. Yeah. And he's just there. And Val is by
far the shittiest character. Yeah, he's the character that it's hard
to like root for him in any way, 'cause you're just like— I mean,
what you're doing is sympathizing with a parent who has a pain-in-the-ass kid who's just
trying to do what they can to make them happy. It's a weird trail of,
like, who's to blame, 'cause it's sort of like, all right, like, look, Val can't
control who he fell in love with, and who he fell in love with seems
like a very lovely person, Barbara. We learn about this in a second, but,
like, basically, he's getting married. Val tells his dad, Armand, I'm getting married.
It's a girl. I met her at school, like, whatever. And Armand's like, you're gonna
throw your life away, like, all this kind of stuff. And he's, like, not cool
with it. They even do this little— thing where he's like, if you do this,
you leave here, you never come back. Like, you're cut off forever. Yeah. Val calls
the bluff and is like, okay, Dad, sorry, nice to see you, nice to know
you, take care. And of course Armond pulls him in like, you pisser, you just
called my bluff, right? Like you were saying, we got 2 big bluff calls in
like the first 10 minutes here. Um, but really the, the sort of trail of
who's to blame here is like, well, so Barbara, as it turns out, her parents
are ultra conservative. Her father is Kevin Keeley,
senator from Ohio. and the co-founder of a group called the Coalition
for Moral Order, which has got many sort of like corollary-type groups
that actually existed at the time, you know, but are like this kind of mid-'90s
resurgence of like the Contract with America, Newt Gingrich, like all this blah,
blah, blah, the sort of reaction to the Clinton presidency. Yeah. Um, so she
has shitty parents who may, you know, have made it clear to her that like
with, you know, if it was obvious who's Val's family— who Val's family really was,
they would have a problem with it. They would say no or cut her off,
or there would be some massive consequences. Yeah, they have no like give in their
position. No, exactly. Val fell in love with who he fell in love with,
so are you really gonna blame Val for falling in love with who he fell
in love with? No, but then he asks his dad to just completely lie about
who he is, send Albert, who we've kind of established, or gets
established, like, has basically been the maternal figure in his life. Yep. Send him away,
like, all this stuff. So it's like, yeah, you're shitty.
So it's like, I guess we can easily sympathize with Armand.
He's in the most kind of like— Armand and Albert are in the most like—
He's been the most put in a position out of all of us. Exactly,
kind of thing. Yep. But then Val, you're kind of like, dude, could you have
a couple of balls in you there to stand up to—? It is crazy.
Yeah, it's so bad. Being 20 is such a big difference than being even
25, 30. But yeah, it is like...
I mean, you have to figure this out. You have to, like...
If you let this be the beginning of the relationship, then you've made that compromise
forever. It's crazy. Yeah. So, not a fan of Val
here. No. Um, and not a likable enough character to be like, oh, well,
I want this guy's love to work out. So no, agreed. Um, but they,
uh, so as they're having this kind of conversation, he wants Armond
to get on the phone. Val calls Barbara and
they're talking. He's like, okay, well, I told my dad and everything, and they're getting
all excited. Um, and Barbara and Armond
like gets on the phone with her, but she's been kind of telling fibs to
her parents because she knows what Armond and Albert— like, she doesn't
care. She's aware and she's like fine with all of it, but she's
kind protecting her parents. And then her dad, Gene Hackman, is in the midst of,
A, a big election, and B, kind of a big scandal, which we find out
about in a minute. Right, the scandal hasn't broken yet, but he is— this Coalition
for Moral Order thing seems fairly new. Like, it's something that has just kind of
hit the scene. So he's been on talk shows and stuff. He's clearly also written
a book, because there's several scenes where he's going through the typist's manuscript.
It's almost like he handwrote a novel or something. And now there's this huge manuscript
he has to go through and check. So he's got a lot going on.
reelection campaign, like, whatever, right? And so he gets on the phone and,
like, overhears the conversation between Armond and Barbara.
And all he really places is that Barbara said that he's the
cultural attaché to Greece. Yeah. Um, and he— and she saw
Val that day. Now Val's with his dad, so she now has to pivot super
fast. Like, they came home, they came home for vacation, they're in South Beach or
whatever. It's like, so every— this is lie on lie on lie. Uh, but yeah.
And it is funny, like, throughout this how credulous Gene Hackman's character
is. Like, for being someone who's, like, laying down the law on this is how
things are, should be, and he believes like everything that's presented to him,
you know. Uh, one thing I will say, Coalition, uh, for Moral
Order, right? They could have done like Coalition of Moral Excellence or
something that's like a pun, like that works out to say cum or something like
that. I think it's just a missed opportunity for a joke. Fair. That's fair.
Um, does Como not work? Oh no, it's gonna be good. Oh no, it wouldn't
be. Yeah, you can actually pronounce it. CFMO. Yeah, total missed opportunity.
Uh, and so we've got, we've got a little, uh, Azaria Back
at the house, because yes, he's talking like they're kind of the next morning,
right? So Val had like gone to sleep. Albert came up after the show,
after Val had already gone to bed. He found out Val's visiting exactly, and then
got his laundry very sweetly, like went and gathered his laundry and went and did
it for him. Very mom move. Yeah, really, really mom stuff. There's some
good Hank Azaria talking about his Guatemalan-ness in this
in this part here. My father was the shaman of his tribe, and my
mother was the high priestess. And then Armand's like, "Why they moved to New Jersey?"
And he's like, "I don't know. They're so." But he wants to audition,
basically. Like, Agador wants to be one of the Golden Girls,
wants to be on stage for the drag show. But he asks, like,
when are you gonna let me audition for you again? And he goes, when you
have talent. So clearly, this is a fun little thing between them, but like,
Armond has no intention of letting Agador be in the show. Right, right.
But it's still— it's a fun little kind of back and forth. I love too,
Agador makes Turkish coffee, which Armond is like, ooh, this— what is this, sludge?
And he's like, yeah, I thought it'd be a nice change from coffee. But when
Albert comes home with the groceries, he takes a sip and is like, ooh,
Turkish coffee, delicious. Turkish coffee
is good, but if you're not expecting Turkish coffee, it is jarring. Yeah,
because there's like lots of like spices and things that aren't coffee in
it too. So, so we find out
that the co-founder of this Coalition for Moral Order has been
found dead. Yes. But he was also like a very conservative politician, but was
found dead and in bed with an underage African-American
prostitute. Right. So it's like, okay, you're a child molester and
you, you clearly like some people that
aren't white, you know, which is a— Stepped out of your marriage. And all this
stuff, right? Um, so this is a big scandal for Gene Hackman's character.
He— and there's like press like swarming him, right? So this is a big deal
and it's fucking up all his plans. Yeah. And so,
uh, they decide, hey, uh, Diane Wiest's
character and, and Cloris Leach's character— so this is, uh, I can't remember the name
of the mom, Mrs. Keely, and then Barbara. They kind of both come at the
same time to Gene Hackman. They're like, hey, you know what could like make
this go be better is a wedding, right? We already told you like Barbie wants
to marry this guy or whatever. Like, let's go meet the family and then you
can announce a wedding. And that's, you know, hope and future and family and like
innocence and all this stuff. And he kind of, kind of gets talked into it,
but, you know, not super crazy. There's also a scene in here
real quick, somewhere in here where Albert is reminiscing, flipping through a photo album.
Yes. Of like Val as a young boy. And I think it's really weird,
because all the photos are in black and white. They all look like they were
taken in, like, the '50s. But Val is 20 years old in 1996,
so he's like 3 years older than us. Like, and these are photos of him
as, like, a 10- to 11-year-old, so, like, the late '80s, maybe? You know what
I mean? It's like, why would it look that way? It looks so strange.
No, that is funny. It's probably a props department thing, where we're like,
we need to hammer home that these are old photos, so they gotta be black
and white. And maybe it was easier to, like, splice the actors at young— at
different ages together. Oh, yeah, sure. To make them look like they were standing there
if it was black and white, you know? A sort of Clerks thing where it's
like, hey, the colors will all just match. Nobody will look wrong. We don't have
to worry about the lighting as much if we do it in black and white.
Um, but basically, there is, uh— oh, and then there's a
rehearsal. So, uh, at the Birdcage,
and, uh, Albert is rehearsing with this, uh, dancer who
does not dress in drag. It is a male dancer who stays dressed
as a man. named Celsius, and they're doing this new piece,
and Albert's trying to sing, and the guy is just being rude. He's grabbing his
crotch and chewing gum, and Albert is losing it. Terrible work ethic.
Just your kinda surly, like, ugh, I don't wanna be here
guy. Yeah, and he tries to be all like, well, what am I, just an
object? And Armand's like, no, you do an eclectic bouquet
of dance. You do Fosse, Fosse, Fosse, and Martha Graham, Martha Graham. And he's doing
all these dances. But you do it all inside.
Um, yeah, he was, uh, and what— this was the line that,
um, Albert had about this guy was like, he was upset the guy
was chewing gum and he's like, well, it helps me think. He's like, you know,
I don't— there's not enough gum in the world for that or whatever. You're wasting
your gum. Yeah, you're wasting your gum. Um,
so, uh, so Val kind of proposes
to Armand like what he wants the deal to be.
He's like, look, Barbara's parents are gonna come meet us.
Yeah, this is who they are. Yeah, and our mom doesn't know who it is.
Yeah, yeah, he's not aware. It's funny, he's like, do you ever read the newspaper?
He's like, yeah, Variety, National Enquirer, the arts and leisure section of
the New York Times. Um, so, uh, so he ends up,
you know, telling him who he is, and he's like, look, basically like,
Dad, tone it down. Right, right, right. Like, big time. Including the house,
including, you know, he's like, it would help if you weren't like They have a
lot— they have a lot of fertility statues around. Yeah, there's all this artwork.
A nude statue of Neptune and all this kind of stuff. And of
course, Armond himself is wearing foundation, you know, like makeup. And so,
really shitty of Val, he puts his finger up to Armond's— to his dad's jaw
and gets some foundation on his hand and wipes it on the wall, which I'm
like, dude, do you know how expensive it is to sponge-paint a wall? Like,
that's gonna— you can't wash that. It'll screw it up. Right, 'cause it's gonna mess
up the whole pattern. It's got texture. Yeah, you know, it's, ugh. So, but anyway.
one more way Val's being a shithead. Disrespectful. And just like lighting up cigarettes
in the middle of the house. But I guess that's fine there too. Because Armond
smokes, I think maybe that happens more often. But it's funny too, actually, every time
Val tries to light a cigarette, Armond takes it from him. Like, he doesn't want
Val to smoke, but he himself is smoking through most of the movie. Yeah,
yeah. But that's a very like parent kind of thing. Uh, some of the stuff
that they have to move is funny, right? He picks up this, you know,
this statue that's like a, a little idol type thing with a penis.
And then he— and then Armond goes to turn it around backwards. There's like this
huge ass crack. He's like, I don't know if that's any better.
Is that better? So, but they, they, you know, he basically says initially to Val,
like, I'm not doing it, man. Like, I am who I am. It's taken me
20 years to understand who I am, and I'm not gonna, you know, fuck the
senator. I don't care what he thinks. Yeah. Um, is it weird he quoted himself
from Popeye by saying, I am who I am? I am what I am.
Uh, yeah. So, but he basically decides, no, I'm not doing it.
Um, we get a little scene back at the Keeley house where Kevin— Gene Hackman
tries to climb out the window to avoid the press. Yeah. Which is shitty as
hell because the wife, Diane Wiest, is like, what are you gonna do? I don't
want to be out there alone. He's like, you won't be alone, Barbara will be
with you, you coward-ass fuck. Yeah, but he goes to climb out and the press
must have been waiting for him or something. I don't know, they might have seen
the ladder, right? There's a huge ladder. Seriously, hard to hide
the purpose of that. Yeah, it's not like something he like threw out the window
and like starts climbing. No, it's just there. So they're talking, and so he stops
short— press conference on the ladder. Yeah, he kind of stops short of
fully like saying, oh, there's gonna be a wedding or whatever, but basically he actually
tries to misdirect the, the crowd, the press, and says we're going to our farm.
Uh, it doesn't say where, but I'm assuming somewhere there in Ohio where he's a
senator from. Um, but there's another, uh, one of the journos there is
from the National Enquirer, this kind of fat guy, and he had already paid off
the driver, uh, to ask where he's taking him. Right. And he's
told him South Beach, Florida. And so he calls out and is the one that
calls out and says, where are you headed, Senator? Oh, we're headed to our family
farm. That's all I'm gonna say right now. He's like, so now the journo knows,
cool, nobody else knows where they're going. He's trying to hide where he's
going, which means something interesting is gonna happen. him. Um, so they do start driving
down, and the, uh, the, the— we can see
as they're driving down the highway that there's like a car following them kind of
the whole way. Yeah, these guys are following them. Uh, and, uh, so Armond
has kind of like thought about it, right? And,
and Val sees that, you know, the next morning Armond is doing
work to try to like de-gay the house. Yeah, get rid of
all the artwork and different stuff. To try to make it look like a conservative
person's house, right? And I do— I like This is a very
kind of real moment where, you know, Val's like, oh, like, thank you so
much, Dad, for doing this. And Armond's just like, don't talk to me for a
while. Because that is super relatable. And I want to say to everyone,
just because you don't have a smile on your face the whole time you're doing
something doesn't mean that you're not happy to do it for someone. You're— it's okay
to have a reaction. 100%. If someone has you carry a heavy thing, you can
be like, God, this is fucking heavy. And it doesn't mean that they need to
take it back. You're allowed to react to it. So I do like that they
left space for Armond to be like— he wasn't like, you're my son, I'd do
anything for you. He was just kind of like, fuck you, buddy. Like, yeah,
I'll do this, but we need a little time to cool off. It's sort of
a thing. It kind of gives the indication, like, because I'm doing it, you and
I know we're fine long-term. Yes. But right now, I am furious,
and I don't want to deal with this and you right now. And I think
that's fair. I think that's something, you know, you can't necessarily do with, like,
when your kids are children. No. But once your kids are adults, like, hell yeah,
that's a totally viable sort of, like, response, because you're making it clear to them,
Look, I have boundaries and things that I have
chosen in this one case to move for you. Right. Right? Like, normally I don't
let anybody tell me who I am and who I'm not. And I'm not doing
that for you, like, for my life, but I will do that for you tonight
because I love you. But you've gotta know that is costing me something. Yeah.
And I think that was really great. And like I said, it's like in 2
lines, just 2 lines, but we get all of that mainly because Robin Williams is
a fantastic actor and really delivers that line, you know, with so much behind it.
But yeah, so, but the fact remains, they are doing
the cleanup. They're gonna change the house over. They're gonna do it. they got to
talk about. And Armond says— And they keep— Val, this is kind of funny how,
you know, Val is helping and also watching what they're doing, and new things will
appear. And he's like, what's that? They're like, oh, we got this down at the
thrift store. He's like, don't add stuff, just get rid of stuff. So, you know,
they keep trying to help in funny ways. Somebody put Playboys in the bathroom.
He goes, who put Playboy there? It's what they read. Don't add, just subtract.
But Armond now has the problem of having to, quote, get rid of Albert,
have Albert go away for, you know, a night or whatever and go somewhere else
and not be there, because they were thinking earlier Oh, maybe Albert could be explained
away as an uncle. And Armand's like, hey, without a mother here to be
your mother, without a woman here, he's just gonna be your gay Uncle Albert.
That's still a problem, right? Yeah. And I was like, yeah, that would still be
a problem. So, they're, you know, Armand and Albert go, they hang out on the
beach for a while, uh, and all this stuff. But Armand kind of opens with,
like, you know, maybe you should go to, like, Boca or something. He says somewhere
else, uh, you know, you're looking, like, tired or whatever. And this sets Albert off,
and he's like, tired means old. Like, I wanna go home. Yeah, yeah. So now
he's like— Armand's trying to keep him from going back home. You know, he like
fakes an injury, an ankle injury, like all this kind of stuff. Right. And then
they get home finally, and Albert screams the— like one of the funniest
screams ever. And I'm not gonna try to do it, but Nathan Lane does a
great scream, and he screams, we've been robbed! Because it looks like the whole thing
is— everything's gone. Oh, it's beautiful. The sound design, yeah. And that's when Val says,
oh, it'll all be back. It'll all be back by the time you get back.
And he goes, where am I going? So Armond hadn't even had a chance to
tell Albert any of this. Like, none of this has been explained.
And, and, you know, Albert is, is rightfully super
fucking pissed off. Well, and if I could give some advice to Val and Armond
in this case, you don't have to say, I'm sorry, Albert, you're too, like,
noticeably gay. Like, you aggress everything. You should be like, Albert,
you've been proven to overreact and be incredibly chaotic and unpredictable
in every situation, and I don't want that this weekend. It probably would
be a better sell. Like, he's been acting insane this whole fucking movie so far,
so it's like, Like you can point to that. Like, it's a good point.
It's not straight. You're acting wild as fuck, right? Your actual
identity is not the issue. Your reactions are the issue. That would be— it would
be an easier sell for sure. Um, so, so the, the plan is— and,
and Armand doesn't tell Val this. Armand's like, okay, well, I'll work on him.
We'll get him out of town. But then he's trying to work with Albert to
like, all right, like, we can get you in. We can have you be an
uncle and, and whatever. And giving him lessons on, you know,
how to do things in a manly way. So we get some funny bits there.
Yes, uh, the mustard smear I think is funny, like real men
smear. Yeah, a lot of— get your pinky down. Yeah, the spoon and
the glass, a lot of pinky. Um, they do the walk. He's like, let me,
let me show you how to walk. Yeah, right. So Albert gets up and walks,
and it's very kind of swishy, and his hands are— and so Armand's like,
let me, let me give you an image. It's a cliché, but it's an image.
John Wayne. You're a big fan. Try that, you know. So he does. He gets
his little straw hat even, whatever, and he starts walking. And he's, again, it's kind
of a, kind of, you know, a saunter, I guess you'd call it, right?
And he walks by this like old woman in a very Florida-looking outfit, the bejeweled
like hat and— ma'am, you know, kind of the whole thing.
Comes back and he goes, no good? And then Armond's like,
no, that was perfect. I just never realized John Wayne walked like that. Yeah,
that was a good payoff. 'Cause I've seen
it, like, it's a very '80s, '90s, like a John
Wayne impression, right? And a very Robin Williams, like from his stand-up thing.
Like that's a jam that he does. And if it was just that,
it would be kind of like, oh, whatever. But the fact that they ended it
with kind of pointing out that like, oh, John Wayne walks hella gay,
you know? And by the way, I'm saying this like in
the context of the movie, like for lack of— like, you, you all know what
I mean by this. Um, so yeah, that was, uh, that was a good
way to end that bit for sure. We also— my wife and I, another thing
that we routinely say and just got into our vernacular is, oh, I've pierced
the toes. Oh, kiss the toes. Kissing the toes. Uh, the other funny
thing where they're practicing kind of having like guy-level small talk,
right? Uh, and, and Robin Williams, he's like, oh, so how about those dolphins?
Whatever. And he— and Robin Williams is giving all this technical stuff and he's
like, how does that make you feel? And he's like, oh, betrayed, bewildered.
Like, that's— that was good. That was a good line by him.
Um, betrayed, bewildered. So, so the conclusion,
I guess, or, or what they're talking about is that they need like a woman
to be present to make this whole thing works. Someone to be playing
Val's mother. Exactly. And then Albert's less of a concern because
there's like a mother-father family there, right? You've got the mom and dad,
and then in the context there's this uncle and he's just in town visiting.
Like, that's a much easier sort of story to tell than like, why are there
just 2 guys and there's no mom? Like, that kind of thing, right? It would
be easier for them. So they decide to enlist the help of Val's birth mother,
uh, Catherine Archer, who has this like big kind of fitness company or something.
We're not sure exactly. I can't tell exactly what it is, but yeah, it's some
kind of like athletic, either athletic wear or gyms or something, played by Christine
Baranski, who's one of my favorite people in Hollywood. Like anything Christine Baranski's
in, she's fantastic. So they go together.
Armand and Albert go together to visit Catherine, although Armand's going to go in and
Albert's just going to wait in the waiting room. So this, the backstory
we get is that, you know, 20-odd years ago, 21 years ago or whatever it's
been since Val's 20, they were in a production together.
Katherine and Armond, and they had an affair, you know, they hooked up
basically. And Armond even says like, you know, I figured, give it
a shot. What are all these straight guys raving about when it comes to like
sleeping with a woman? Like, I'll try. Yeah. And so they did. Apparently that was
enough to conceive Val.
And basically Armond gave Katherine a bunch of money to give
up custody of Val and have Armond take full
custody of him. And that's how she started her business. So it's like very— so
it's a very amicable sort of thing. Catherine seems ecstatic to see him.
Like, like, yeah, she never thought he would— she would again, maybe. But like a
good moment between the two of them. And it's nice that they let it go
so long of them kind of like reminiscing about, uh, the stuff that they were
in together and doing a couple of old bits and all that stuff. Doing a
number here and a little dance there. Yeah. So they gave her probably more screen.
A lot of times, like, that character isn't gonna get like that little chunk,
right? So that was, that was cool to see that, you know. And then as
a theater person, it probably— it, it— I don't know, it gives you feelings about
just the connections that you have with people that you performed with. Absolutely. Even years
and years later, you kind of remember stuff that you did and all that.
Yeah, it's definitely a connection, yeah, that you keep. And, and, but unfortunately,
Albert gets more and more tired of waiting because, you know, Armand was supposed to
go in 15 minutes, chat with him. We get the sense that much more time
than that has passed. Um, Catherine opened a bottle of champagne,
and, uh, and there, when she starts kind of really flirting with him hard,
like talking about his chest hair and kind of doing this stuff, and they're almost
canoodling— I mean, not Armand so much as Catherine is being very forward— as Albert
walks in. and, and, and is freaked out. Albert goes to the car that
they drove, Armand's car, to go there, and it's clearly struggling to drive it but
gets it driven away. But we cut back to the house and Armand has arrived.
Albert's not there yet. Yeah. And he goes, is Albert back yet?
No, I thought he was with you. Great, he's driving back from, you know,
wherever, Palm Beach or whatever, Fort Lauderdale, something like that, you know, with the parking
brake on. Yeah, yeah. We get the sense Albert doesn't do much driving. Yeah,
it's definitely, uh, Armand is is taking care of a lot
of the business. Yes, exactly. Um, yeah, so Albert walks in the door
and, you know, has another meltdown.
A meltdown. Because, okay, you know, I walked in on Armond and stuff, and,
oh, I know what you're trying to do to me, and I'll be leaving.
But clearly, like, wants them to ask him questions about it. And again, like,
they're all acting like vets who have been through his bullshit, like,
multiple times every week for years and years and years, right?
Uh, so they're finally like, oh, okay, well, hey, Albert, where are you going
then? He's like, I'll bite. Like, yeah. And he basically says, like, I'm going
to this— I'm going to this town. Lost Copa. The only thing there is a
cemetery. And he's like, oh, that's why I'm packing light, and storms off.
He says, you're taking a toothbrush to a cemetery? How Egyptian.
Yeah. Um, oh,
man. So, yeah, I mean, he storms off, but then Armand
knows kind of where to find him and where to go get him. He's basically
at a bus stop. Yeah. Waiting to head out of town. And so, yeah,
Armond finds him and brings what they've talked about a few times, the palimony agreement.
And I had to, like, look this up even recently 'cause I've kind of forgot
the exact details, but I guess it's, you know, when you have, like, some kind
of a domestic partnership where there's no marriage involved. And obviously back then, and in
Florida in particular, there would've been no chance for these two to get married in
any meaningful way. The palimony agreement is essentially just a business agreement that says,
I own half of what you own, you own half of what I own,
and it's even split, right? So basically, the closest thing financially
that they could do to marriage, basically, at the time.
And they— and, you know, he brings it and they sign it. And, you know,
Albert's like, I don't want all this stuff. He's like, well, then give it to
me. Like, the point is, I want us together. Like, it's Armond basically saying,
I hadn't done this before, not because I didn't want to do it. I just
didn't think it was that important to you. Now I clearly understand that it is
like something you need to feel good about this. So let's do it. Like,
it's, you know, they're tied together. And that's— it's really a sweet kind of moment.
And it's really funny because it starts off with Armond complaining. about how shitty the
cemetery in Las Copa is and his cemetery plots in Key Biscayne. But now he
has to, you know, it's gorgeous, a beautiful view of the ocean, and now he's
got to sell it to get a plot next to you in that piece of
shit Las Copa. Yeah, yeah. He's so angry about it.
Yeah, that's a nice scene with them on the, uh, on the bus
bench. It's kind of like the, the Norman Rockwell, like where there's the kid with
the I ran away from home bindle and the cop sitting next to him.
It's kind of like Armand with Albert, like, hey, I know you tried to run
away from home, but let's get you back here. Let's get you a cup of
soup and get you back home. Yeah. So,
so Armond is kind of like realizing, like, this is the person
that I love. Like, this is what's important to me. If, if Val's
fiancée and her family don't accept us, then that is 100% on them.
Like, I'm gonna call Mom and tell her not to come. Right. So we're gonna
do it. Yeah. Armond leaves a message with Katherine's, uh, assistant or whatever saying like,
don't come, don't bother. Um, and he's— and she even says, well, she's already on
her way, but I'll try to reach her on her car phone. Right, is what
she says. Um, so back at the house they're all dressing
in like conservative wear, right? So Armond's got his like black suit and tie on,
he's got his hair slicked back, honestly looking like my grandpa. But he says he
looks like his grandpa. And then you look like my grandfather in this suit.
He killed himself when he was 40 or something like that. What do you gotta
say? Do not like Robin Williams making suicide references in movies. It stings
a lot. And I think he does it twice in this movie, and I'm just
like, oh no. Um, but then Albert comes out in his suit
and initially looks good. I mean, he's, you know, he kind of has to struggle
to deliberately walk in a different way than he would normally walk, trying to,
like, play it straight or whatever. But he gets— he sits down and, you know,
whatever, and kind of sits, and he crosses his leg initially more feminine,
and then changes to cross his leg more masculine, all this stuff. And they're kind
of like, okay. And he goes, oh, you figure I dress like this, I'm even
more obvious, right? Like, I took off my rings, I'm dressed just like you.
And then Harmon goes, what about those? And he's wearing these bright pink
socks. He just goes, well, one does want a hint of color.
Yeah. Which is another— that's another one that Heather and I
always say. And it is so funny, though, the way that Albert is dressed.
It's like, all right, this is either— this is either like flamboyant
gay men just wearing a suit or the most vicious killer
in Boardwalk Empire. You know, like, like those flamboyant criminal
guys dress the exact same way that they would, like, make fun of someone for
just like, oh, it's the same thing. Everyone just wants to look good and they
want to have people looking at them. Exactly. Yeah. So they're kind of realizing that,
like, oh, man, this This—
it's good. It's not gonna work. It's not gonna work. Our training, no matter how
much training— and they only had like 6 hours in the first place. Ridiculous.
Yeah, you're not gonna do that. And they did make a comment at one point
earlier talking about training. It's like, you know, Albert said, I'm, I'm an actor,
you're a great director, like, we can do this. Like, this is something we can
do. And they tried and they did their best. But Val, this is another—
he's just such a bitch. He's just mean to everybody. He's like mean to Agador
about like, you know, he goes out and like Agador's lighting some, some candles because
the whole place looks like a fucking monastery now. Yes. Like, it just looks ridiculous.
It is funny how they, they like fully strip it down. There's almost nothing,
just a big wooden crucifix on the wall in one room. A wooden crucifix,
they have a little table, they have a couple of books, a lot of drapes
on the walls to block the view to the outside and stuff. All this stuff,
and so Agador's lighting candles, and he's tried to masculinate his
voice as well, 'cause he's got this very thick accent. And so Val's
like, would you just put your shoes on? He goes, ah, but sir, there is
no reason for me to put my shoes on, because they make me fall down.
And he's like, just put your fucking shoes on. He's so upset about it.
But that's when Katherine calls to verify Armand's message. She goes, hey, I got a—
A message from my assistant about not coming. Is that right? And Val
is one who answers. And so now that you know Albert has run back into
his room and is like not coming out, supposedly like locked himself in. He's like,
"No, no, no, please come, come, come." Like like like that was a mistake.
Like please, you know. And they have a moment over the phone because you know
they've never spoken to each other before. And and she says, "This is Val." And
he's like, "Yeah." She's just like, "Hey, I just want you to know, like I'm
really really happy I can do this for you." Yeah. You know, which is great.
Like she she really is just you know knows that she obviously hasn't been part
of his life, obviously. So this is cool that she can do something for him.
She Yeah, yeah. Um, yeah, weird dynamic for that kind of
relationship, but I think they keep the proper distance. You know, it's not like,
oh, you live with me half the time now. It's very much like
they're fine with the decision that was made 20 years ago. Um,
so yeah, so they end up— uh, the parents
are on the way, right? So the idea is that even if,
uh, if Christine Baranski gets there when she's supposed to
get there, she's gonna be there after— A little late, yeah. The parents of— Barbara's
parents, right? And they show up, and we get a funny scene of the
shoes make him fall down. He wasn't kidding. Agador does
fall down when he puts shoes on. Good physical comedy. It's a good pratfall.
Yeah. And so, so we're introduced now to
Barbara and her parents. Yep. So the Keelys have arrived, and there's a lot of
like— and then there's initial confusion because, first of all, Agador answers the phone,
I am Spartacus. He's decided to change his name, hasn't told anybody. And,
you know, like, welcome to the Goldmans or something like that. The goal— I'm the
Goldmans' butler or something like that. And so And then Barbara had told her parents
that the last name was Coleman because she also didn't want them to think— among
all the other things she doesn't want her parents to understand is that Armond is
Jewish. Yeah, yeah. And that's also, you know, no, no, no, no kind of thing.
Um, and so then it's like, is it Goldman? Coleman? Like, there's some— there's some
misunderstanding right now. The crazy part is when they drove up to the building
with the nightclub in front, it says Armond Goldman Presents on the front, right?
They're meeting an Armond Coleman. Even that should have been a bit of a tip-off,
but there's no recognition at all. It is fun. Oh, when they first kind of
arrive in town, so they're kind of pulling into the same that we saw from
the opening shot, right? Like people in thongs and like men and women in thongs,
scantily dressed, all kinds of stuff. And they're looking out the window and I think,
uh, I think they're like, oh yeah, they said this all popped up since they
bought the place. It was all sand when they bought here. They would never move
in there, right? Uh, and then there's kind of a comment with the Coleman Goldman
thing. They say something about— he said, oh, this neighborhood used to be all Jewish.
It was like, oh, Barbara said it used to be all sand. He's like,
oh, you know what they say, when there's sand, where there's sand, there's sand.
But then, yeah, but they respond to— or, you know, Val and Armand calls Agador,
they call him Agador, and then Val corrects him to Spartacus, and they say Agador
Spartacus. He insists on being called his full name, which I always thought was hilarious.
But basically, outside the building now, more journalists
have— or no, the initial journalists have arrived. So the 2 guys that follow them
are there, and they see the driver and
pay him another bunch of money, whatever, to say where did they go. They went
in the building across the street. Yeah. So now they're kind of scoping it out.
They're obviously not just gonna like try to walk in or anything, but they're like
looking around. The, the name has actually been changed on the, on the ring,
the doorbell outside, to say Coleman. Um, something Val must have done at some point.
And so they're asking, Coleman, Coleman, the last name Coleman, know nothing? That's so crazy.
And then one guy's like, what about the name on the front of the building?
Armand Goldman. Goldman. Like, he figures it out. Yeah, yeah. And sort of they check.
Oh, it turns out, yeah, like he owns the building, he owns the nightclub.
Like, yeah, like that's him kind of thing. Which is super funny.
Inside the building, well, we find out Katherine's stuck in traffic. She's at like some
kind of drawbridge or something. Yeah, there's a lot of— I can't remember what they're
called. They're like— yeah, there's some term for all these, like, they're like bridges,
but they're also the causeways, I think they call them, throughout Miami that make it
very difficult to get from one part of Miami to another depending on what time
of day it is and stuff. Yeah. And so she's stuck, so they're gonna wait
a little longer. And Kevin Keeley— so Gene Hackman's character
starts telling the story about the foliage, the changing foliage
as they drove from Ohio through Virginia. And it is the most boring
fucking story about the leaves changing, right? And it's the most politician,
no information kind of story too. Like, no opinions, no information.
And talk about Purple Mountain's Majesty. Like, yeah, just the
most boring shit ever. Um, yeah, so,
and he's— and they keep kind of like— the
phone rings at a point in his story and they don't pick it up,
but then it goes to the answering machine and Val goes and grabs it.
It's Catherine, right? Because it's her. And they're so— and they're like disappearing to the
kitchen and coming back. And, uh, Kevin Keeley, Gene Hackman, is kind of like,
something's going on here. Like, it's like the only time he's skeptical of
anything, right, throughout this. Uh, so— and they're just like,
okay, Mom's gonna be late, she's gonna be another half an hour, whatever. And then
inverse Mom, right? And it's Albert doing the
Mrs. Doubtfire type thing. Yeah, very much. Uh,
yeah, so, and when he first pops in, Agador starts
laughing hysterically and has to like— can't even stop himself
laughing, has to like cover his mouth and just be escorted out of the room.
I want to say this movie to me is, is a good movie,
um, from the beginning until the Keighleys arrive at the house. But from where
the Keighleys arrive to the end, it is a spectacular movie. Like, I honestly—
the, the, the jokes come super fast, the,
the missed identity stuff is hilarious. To me, there's so many like
laughs in this movie, kind of in this dinner scene and on,
and and this is where it really like ramps up. And so Albert appearing as
Mrs. Coleman Goldman, which again there's now an additional problem because she says
Goldman or something, and and there's there's a problem.
But yeah, we've had some confusion. Is it Coleman? And she goes, "Well, it depends
on where you are." Like in France, in France, where Armand's
château is, it's Col de la Manne or Col of the Isle of Man.
Yeah, which is like the most ridiculous. It's like, name ever. So we
don't really know where we are until we hear our last name pronounced. Yeah.
Uh, and, and the
second Albert shows up, like, it puts Kevin Keeley is
just like, oh, hell yeah. Yeah, yeah, I dig this. Like, this is, this is
it. Like, I was a little suspicious, but now with the crucifix,
and then he referred to not a lot of clever books on the shelves,
which I think was cool. It was like all like Nancy Drew or something.
Yeah, because, uh, Agador, when he got this big crucifix, was like, and they also
gave me a bunch of books. And I feel like he said something Like they're
due back next week, or like that he was just given all these old library
books. But yeah, and and Kevin is immediately getting
into like there's like no pleasant conversation.
He's like launching into all his like political talking points like right
away and gay marriage like all this stuff and Clinton's bad like all this
stuff and and you know Albert's trying to play along and sort of agreeing with
a lot of the the stuff and and so she said something well he
said something. Something, uh, as the mom. I don't remember exactly what it was,
but I do remember that, uh, Senator Keeley's response was, that's exactly what Rush
Limbaugh said. Yes. Yeah, there's some name
checks in this. Yeah, they're very mid-'90s. Um, is it Billy Graham?
He says it's too— because— or too liberal? No, it's the, the Pope is too
liberal. The Pope is too controversial. We'll get Billy Graham. And then later he says
Bob Dole. He was going to say Bob Dole's too liberal, but his wife Louise
says he's too dark. Oh, he's dark too, but I was gonna say too liberal.
I think that's the year— '96 would be the year that Dole— that
would have been the Clinton— yeah, that would have been the year that Dole ran
against Clinton. Bush, that's right. Yeah, that's right.
Yeah, so, uh, so they're getting along great.
Like, nobody's pushing back, but, uh, but Armond is
uncomfortable by this, right? So there's a scene as these questions are coming,
and nobody's had a chance to adjust to Albert arriving. They didn't have
a little meeting in the fucking— in the Uh,
what's it called? The kitchen. In the mudroom first, and then, and then go in
there. Yeah, yeah. So he's just like, what the fuck? And he's going around nervously
putting ice in everybody's cups and stuff like that. But they're getting along kind of
famously, and they end up having this great, like, little singing and dancing moment,
right? Yeah, they do. Uh, before dinner is served, they do, uh, what,
from, uh, um, it's from My Fair Lady, I Could Have Danced All Night,
like, whatever. And it's like their piano and they're dancing and singing. Yeah, everybody's getting
along Great. We should mention, in the meantime, a ton more journalists have shown up
because somebody got footage from, uh, the Keelys' house of
the National Enquirer guy, like, getting the bribe and finding
out they're going to South Beach or whatever. So that's kind of become knowledge.
So now there's, like, TV vans and all these reporters and cameras all
over the south— the street out front, Ocean Boulevard. And, and so now, you know,
there's this heightened sort of issue of how are they going to get out of
here? Yeah. Right, is kind of the thing. Yeah, uh, and so as
they're, uh, about to serve dinner, right, they lay out the, the plates
and everything, and they see that the bowls and the plates, uh, Kevin Kiley's kind
of examining. He's like, oh, these are interesting. Like, is that like naked men?
And it's all this, you know, different artwork where it's like, you know, like you
said with the fertility idols and stuff, it's all this stuff. And there's like,
you know, very Greek. There are 2 men having sex on this, right? And then
the family very quickly reacting to that is like, oh, mine has women too.
Yeah, I have girls on mine. So that's
a good thing. And, uh, and they're missing, uh, they're missing their glasses.
I think Kevin Keeley and his wife are both like, oh, where are my glasses?
And the kids are both kind of like, oh, I don't know, I guess they're
gone. I looked, didn't find them yet. Trying to keep their vision low, but they
have to rush to get the soup in those bowls to cover up the dicks.
Agador has created, uh, a soup or whatever. He's got shrimps that he isn't able
to put in the thing because Armand runs out with it. And he says,
it's like, oh, this is seafood chowder. And he starts putting it, and then like
Louise is like Senator Kelly's wife is like, "Isn't this an
egg? Why is there an egg?" He's like, "Oh yes, it's it's a it's a
huevo. It's very big in Guatemala." He's trying to play it up, but it's just
all bullshit. And he says, like a woman is said to be like worth her
weight in hens, and a man is judged by the size of his cock.
And he walks off. But then it's like they're they try this stew
or whatever it is, this soup, and they it's all everybody hates it. It's terrible.
All reach for bread at the same time. And so then Val goes
to check on what's going on in the kitchen, and Armand's in there. banging his
head against the wall, and he says he didn't make an entrée. And Agador's like,
it's sweet and sour peasant soup, it is an entrée. Why do you think I
made so much? It's like a stew. Like, you know, um, Val kind of needs
to sneak out of there. And what they want him to do, because they know
that his mom is still on the way, she's unreachable, she's in the car.
So in her mind, I'm just running late, but I'm trying to get here.
And they say, hey, Val, go down, like, put a note for your mom,
says like, don't come in under any circumstances. We'll explain later. Like, deal with it
later. And he goes down and does that. But then the reporters who have been
kind of stalking them like pull it off. Yeah, like, oh, this might be useful
information, and just to fuck everything up, right? Like, yeah, so they take it away.
And one of the reporters, the guy who's kind of like the sidekick of the
main reporter, was in True Lies. He was one of our favorite crew members with
Tom Arnold and Arnie. That's right. And he, and he in fact, he had a
camera. He has a camera in this show or whatever,
like, or this movie, and he had a camera at part of True Lies because
he was the like camera crew that got sent to take down the terrorists,
and he had the gun in it and everything. Same, uh, same same there.
So yeah, um, so at some point they all notice as,
uh, as Albert's getting up, the wig— his, uh, his wig
slips. Yeah, yeah. And they're able to kind of get on it pretty quickly.
I think Barbara goes to Albert and says like, hey, can you show me where
the bathroom is? Mother Coleman, get out of here. Uh, and they're all kind of
rushing around Albert to fix this situation. Yeah, which leaves just
the Keelys. Mr. and Mrs. Keely are the only ones left alone at the dinner
table. And Senator Keeley is super like
pissed. Like he thinks that this is, you know, that Mrs. Coleman is such a
tread-upon woman. And, and, you know, Armond, you know, Armond must have a,
um, you know, a side piece, kind of like all this like stuff. And,
and basically like acting way more concerned about this woman who he
does not know is a man than he has ever about his wife, it certainly
seems. Um, but as they are kind of arguing, the Keileys, Catherine shows
up, walks right in. Oh, Mr. and Mrs.— Senator and Mrs. Keeley,
I'm so glad to meet you. I'm Catherine Goldman. Val's mother, you know,
whatever. And it's like— and that's about when Albert, you know, Wig Fix,
and the others come out, and now it's confrontation time. It's like, what the fuck
is going on? Right. And, and when, uh, when she arrives at the door,
it's very funny that Agador goes up. He's like, oh,
hello, uh, miss. May I take your purse as usual, or for
the first time? Like, he doesn't even know which, which side to play. Like— Yeah.
But Val finally does the right thing because he
He, uh, you know, he basically—
Senator Healy's like, we need an explanation here. Like, who, who is Val's mother?
Like, this is— this woman has said she's Val's mother. You've said this is Val's
mother. So who's Val's mother? And, and he does the right thing. He says,
this is— and he takes, uh, Albert's wig off and he says, this is my
mother. Like, this is the person who raised me. Like, you know, kind of thing.
And, you know, but, you know, Katherine here,
like, she, she birthed me or whatever kind of thing. And, and she introduces herself.
So nice to finally meet you, Val. Like, it's very— which I'm sure is like
kind of like, oh my God, extra mind-blowing for the Healys. Yeah. But Senator Keeley
is completely— he's like, huh? But you're a man. What? I don't understand. But wait,
2 minutes. He's just like— and the wife is like, what, Kevin? Yeah, get it.
They're gay. They're a couple. Like, what is so hard to understand about this?
Yeah. But then she's like, Barbara, we're leaving. And she's like, no, no, no,
I'm not leaving. I don't want to go anywhere. I don't want to go anywhere.
And that's when they turn to leave and the National Enquirer
guys are right at the door. And one of them's got a camera and the
other one goes, Senator Keeley! But like, as he He turns, he sees the
camera, and he shuts the door. Yeah, so they don't have a picture of him,
but now they know, like, everybody's there. They even go into, like, the bedroom to
look down onto the main street there, and they can see all the news vans.
Like, they're screwed. Catherine mentions, like, it's their word against
yours you were even here, you know? And they're like, yeah, unless they get a
photo of us. And so they need a plan, right, uh, to get
out, right? And, uh, so is this, like, as they, uh,
discover— there's a couple kind of funny things. Is one is, uh,
as Albert is explaining like, yeah, you know, I'd love
Val just like any parent loves them. And, you know, it's the exact same.
Uh, it's still me with just one tiny difference. Well, not a tiny
difference, right? Tiny. I don't know if that gets the giant hog hashtag since we're
hinting at it, but we love, uh, hashtagging stuff like that. Um,
yeah. And then, uh, shit, what was the other thing there? Uh, I'm not gonna
think of it. Um, so yeah, the press is everywhere, and we're like, how are
we gonna get out? So they couldn't storm out. So now they have to,
like, reconcile. They have to, like, deal with these people. 'Cause you're the only people
that can help them. Well, and that's the thing is that like, yeah, so now
the Keelys are stuck there. Look, I think there's a little bit of realization happening.
One, that they had been having a pretty good time at dinner. Like, these,
these were people they were enjoying the company of, right? Right. They're now in a
position where these folks could just throw them out to the wolves and be like,
okay, well, leave now, and then deal with what you gotta deal with, right?
But they're not. They're trying to help them through it. And it's obvious that Val
and Barbara, you know, care very much for each other. I think there's a lot
of this going on for the Keelys. And so the plan becomes, well,
if you're in drag on the way out, like, they're not gonna recognize
you, they're not gonna understand that it's you. This doesn't work today with
cell phone cameras in everybody's pocket, people filming things all the time,
right? Because they would have gotten caught. Sure. Because it was the television crews,
and they're probably hooked up to like live feeds and stuff, they wouldn't just
be filming, they'd be waiting to set up to then start filming kind of thing,
or start taping or broadcasting or whatever. So it's not an always-on
panopticon kind of thing. But today, somebody's getting a shot of
Senator Keeley in drag coming out. And it's not like he looks nothing like himself.
No, you know what I mean? Being like a tall— like Gene Hackman's a tall
guy too. Yeah. Uh, not that there weren't like tall drag queens at
the, at the thing, but— At the show, yeah. I mean, it's a, it's a
face that's noticeable, right? If you're looking for that face, you'd probably spot the face
even with a wig and a dress on. So we, we basically end the movie
very similarly to how we began with We Are Family, uh, and,
and the song plays and they basically are all kind of like walking, dancing,
joining the crowd through the club and then out the front door. and they get
into, uh, Catherine's car. She's gonna drive them away. And then Gene Hackman says
to their original driver, like, meet me in 20 minutes on the corner of,
you know, this and that. He goes, lady, not for a million bucks. Yeah,
yeah. Which is like, okay, so apparently the, the costume was good enough that the
driver did not recognize him. Right, right. Um, but yeah, I think after that it's
just, uh, we get the wedding during the, uh, the end credits. Yeah, we get
the wedding, which— oh, and there's another point that they bring up, you know,
with the, the Coleman Goldblum. So when they really— they have
this kind of big reveal of Albert is actually Albert, and, and then
our last name is Goldman, not Coleman. So this whole thing where you expect,
uh, Kevin Kiley to be like, I can't believe you're a man, he's like,
I can't believe you're Jewish. You can't be Jewish. But then at the end when
they're having the wedding, they're clearly having one of those joint, like,
Catholic-Jewish, uh, wedding celebrations. Dual denomination.
Yeah, yeah. Um, so that is it.
And of course Albert is crying throughout the, uh, the whole ceremony.
And, uh, that little shit Val got everything he wanted. He got everything he
wanted. He's got his parents. He now knows his birth mother that
he didn't know before. She's now in his life and he's gotten married and all
this stuff. And I'm sure Senator Keeley is still campaigning on the
Coalition for Moral Order's platform and has to pretend that his daughter
isn't married to the son of gay people or something. I don't know how that
works for him, but whatever. Senator Keeley was supposed to be like 60 at the
time, 65 at the time. 30 years later, he's still in the Senate and he's
still running for reelection this year. Very Jesse Helms-ish. Yep. Well, that's The Birdcage.
That is The Birdcage. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I'll go ahead and give my rating
first. I— look, I mean, like I said, I love this movie. This is a
movie I have a ton of nostalgia for. It's a movie my wife loves as
well, so she and I watch it, you know, on a fairly regular basis.
Um, I think it's very funny. I think that for the most
part, the, the, the sort of themes and stuff certainly hold up. Um,
there's a— there are several uses of the F-slur, which is not something that I
enjoy in movies, but they're used in every case as a self-description by
queer characters. Yeah, it's not— it's much more
of like, you know, watching Menace to Society. Yeah, it's like watching
Menace to Society and they're using the N-word with each other all the time because
that's the culture they're in. They're all in the in-group. Same kind of thing here.
The F-slur is used only by the characters who kind of like can claim that
word for themselves. Other than that, I don't think any of it like aged poorly
outside of some like topical references that aren't really topical anymore because
it's, you know, almost 30 years later. But it gives you a chance to Wikipedia
some stuff. Yeah, they mentioned Mapplethorpe, Billy Graham, you know, they mentioned Jeb
Bush. Jeb Bush is mentioned several times, you know, the young Kennedys. Like, there's a
lot of things that kind of, you know, didn't age great in that sense,
but what are you gonna do? It's a product of its time. I love this
story outside of the Val part. I love the story as it pertains to
parents doing what they feel like they, you know, kind of need to do
or can do for their children and wanting to give them everything. Like, that part
of it I love. Val is a hard person to root for, uh, so I
don't. The movie to me is about— is about Armand and about Albert and in
part about Barbara because she seems very sweet. We don't get any sense
that she's, you know— I don't even get the sense that she's pushing Val to
do this. It really feels like Val is setting up all of the sort of
like things— let's be careful, let's be careful— seem to be coming more from him
than from her. But maybe that's just— I'd rather think of it that way because
I already don't like him. Yeah. Um, I'm a 4.5 out of 5 on The
Birdcage. It's not a perfect movie, but it is so funny. I laughed my ass
off through it again and again. This one that I know I've got, you know,
a ton of nostalgia for, but I really do think it's, it's a really spectacular
comedy. Uh, it's very heartfelt in a lot of, a lot of ways,
uh, and it just produced several really laugh-out-loud scenes.
Uh, and, and Hank Azaria is a wonderful treat. So yeah, I'm 4.5
out of 5. All right, well, uh, yeah, so this is my first time
seeing this movie, and like I try to do with a movie I haven't seen
before, I'll watch it twice. I'll watch it once all the way through to just
kind of get the feeling of it and then watch it again to, to get
notes and everything like this. Um, I do want to say I relate to,
uh, one part of this is, uh, my wife and I used to work with
someone who was like a daughter of a Kevin Keeley type politician.
Uh, he's not in the Senate, but he's in Congress now, and he's like a
real, uh, piece of shit. Like ultra conservative,
just whatever. She really could have used a
dinner party at a drag queen couple's, uh, house.
Like, she really needed to be exposed to that kind of shit because she sucked
at it. She was terrible. So I'm in favor
of, like, exposing people to this and realizing, you know, like, we're all the same
and stuff. I definitely like that,
that kind of feeling in a movie.
So the first time I watched it,
I didn't like it at all. Okay. I was really struggling and like, I wanted
to— like, I like what it's about and I like the people in it,
but I was just like, Nathan Lane is too annoying to me. I can't root
for him. Val's sucks. Too bad. I can't root for him. Robin Williams
is not being funny. I can't root, you know. Interesting. So I had a really,
really hard time with it, uh, and I watched it the second time and I
came around a bit on some of it. Like, I, I saw some more sweetness
between, uh, Albert and Val and Albert and Armand, and I like
that relationship a little bit more. Um, the Kevin Kiley character,
I think, was— it's funny, like, his best work is telling
his, like, meandering story. I think was, like, the best thing that,
that he did. There. I think this movie didn't
have as much comedy as I would have liked to have for
something with Robin Williams in it. And I feel like it suffers a bit
from the Mrs. Doubtfire curse. Interesting. Because some of the gags that they could have
put in this movie that would have been funny, I think would have overlapped too
much with stuff that happened in Doubtfire. Like if you were trying to have a
scene like it, does Albert need to keep changing in and out of, you know,
the outfit, stuff like that? I I mean, the montages of
dressing up. It's just that this came out 2 years earlier or 3 years earlier.
And like, there's a lot of things they'd be like, ah, this would be good
in our movie. But they just did that. So all this is
to say, I did have a tough time with this. And I
came around on it a bit. It's not really like my type
of film. Sure. It didn't have enough like punch
as far as comedy for me. So I'm going to give The Birdcage a 2
out of 5. But I want to be clear that this is just
kind of specific to the type of movies that I generally like to see.
There's a reason this movie made a lot of money. There's a reason this movie
is very beloved. Um, it just didn't work for me very much. I'm just like
trying to be honest about my experience of watching it. So, well, that's, that's where
we're at for The Birdcage. Thank you, everybody. This is the final episode of Two
Dads One Movie. We're never gonna— I'm kidding. No, no caveats necessary,
man. We all have our own tastes, and, and this only ties the biggest
gap between our scores, by the way. Okay, 2.5 is— we've done this a few
times, so that's right. 6.5 out of 10 is the final score from the 2
dads on The Birdcage, and I will accept that, uh, even though it is one
of my favorite movies. It's not for everybody, obviously, and it— and it's— it's—
I know that my nostalgia for it is a major factor in
that, and that— and that's fine. So what are you bringing to the table next
week, Nick? What are we gonna watch next week? Well, I, I know, uh,
we've kind of been in the spirit of Like talking about groups
of people in our country that have been historically mistreated and discriminated
against. Yep. And my next movie touches on, I think, the group that
is the most discriminated against in the history of our country—the troops.
Okay, the troops. And we're gonna follow. I thought
you were gonna say cops. That's true too.
We are gonna follow a Vietnam veteran. veteran, uh, as he
is kind of, you know, wandering the country, just making a life for himself,
trying to visit his old friends. And he, uh, runs up against
some very unpleasant police officers. We're gonna go to—
I don't know if this is Washington or Oregon, somewhere Washington State— and,
uh, spend some time with John Rambo as we, uh,
as we check out First Blood. Nice. I have never
seen First Blood. I'm well aware of, like, I'm super familiar with like basically the
plotline, which there isn't a ton of. Like, it's not a convoluted storyline. It's a
pretty basic setup. Yeah, I know that it's not, you know, that the later Rambo
movies leaned so much harder into just the spectacle of the action. Yes, First Blood
was like meant to be a little more, you know, there's supposed to be like
a dude or whatever. Yeah, you know, kind of thing. Yeah, so I'm looking forward
to that. But yeah, I've never actually seen it. I just know, I know Brian
Dennehy, he's a piece of shit, and I know that John Rambo fucks shit up.
So yeah, well, that's, that's what I'm going in with. Made in heaven,
baby. Exactly. All right, so next week we will watch First That's a
wrap. If you like what you hear, please consider heading over to Apple or Spotify
and leaving us a 5-star review. It helps new folks find the show. Be sure
to check out our website at twodads1movie.com. That's the number 2 and the number 1.
There you can explore the movies we've covered, sign up for our newsletter, The Rewind,
and even get sneak previews of upcoming episodes. Once again, this has
been The Birdcage, another episode of 2 Dads 1 Movie. I'm Steve.
And I'm Nic. Thank you so much for listening, and we'll catch you next week.
Thanks,