Transcript

Intro Clip

My friend and I have this long running argument here. It is says that when you come to a place like this, you, you can't just be yourself, you have to have an act. So anyway, I, I saw you standing there so I thought A, I, I could just leave you alone, B, I could come up with an act or C, I could just be myself. I chose C. What? I think that A, you have an act and that B, not having an. Act is your act. Thank you.

Steve

It's two Dads one Movie. It's the podcast where two middle aged dads sit around and shoot the about the movies of the 80s and 90s. Here are your hosts, Steve Paulo and Nic Briana. Hello everybody. Welcome back. The 2 Dads 1 movie. I'm Steve.

Nic

I'm Nic.

Steve

And today we are talking about a movie that came out in 1992. The movie is called Singles. It's by Cameron Crowe and it's kind of one of those movies that defined a generation, as it were. Let me start off real quick and say, Nic, I think you told us at the end of the last episode you'd never seen Singles before. Is that right?

Nic

Never seen it before? No.

Steve

Excellent. This is going to be fun. This is fun time.

Nic

Interesting to see for the first time now. Yeah. Yes, we'll get into that a little bit.

Steve

As we dive over time on this podcast, we really intend to focus on things that are nostalgic for one or the other of us or we think are nostalgic in general for people. But it is some fun sometimes to look back and go, well, if I didn't have nostalgia for this, would it even be a movie worth watching? I think that's, that's a fair question to ask at any given time. Okay, let me run down a little bit about some facts about Singles. So it was released on September 18, 1992, running time time of 99 minutes. Written and directed by Cameron Crowe. It stars among a ton of cameos and, and small parts and things we'll get into later. I would say. Fair to say it stars Bridget Fonda, Campbell Scott, Kira Sedgwick and Matt Dillon. Rotten Tomatoes pretty much dug this movie. The critics liked it. It got a 79, not out of this World. Pretty good, but pretty, pretty good. And IMDb though actually kind of the opposite of the last movie we did where the Rotten Tomatoes score was low. The IMDb score is respectable. This is a pretty high Rotten tomatoes, but only seven on IMDb. So, you know, maybe it hasn't aged well or whatever, but that's, that's what it got. It did win a single award kind of in at the 1993 MTV Video Music Awards. The music video for Alice in Chains song would one best video from a film. Because that song is featured pretty prominently in this movie. It's on the soundtrack and then the video. The music video included scenes from singles. The budget for this film, best I could find was something in the 9 to 10 million dollar range. It wasn't actually easy to track them exactly how much. And it earned about 18 and a half million, which if it was 9 for the budget, that gives it about a 2x multiplier, which, you know, that's not too bad. It's respectable. It's not a hit necessarily, but yeah, pretty good. Pretty okay.

Nic

Although looking from a 2025 lens, if you said that they made this movie in the early 90s at the height of grunge, that included Eddie Vedder and Chris Cornell and Allison Chains and all that, you would think that it would have done a little bit better.

Steve

You'd think, yeah, I'm not really kind of sure. I think because they were all cameos. Like, none of the. I don't know if, like, word of mouth just didn't work as well back then or what. Right. Because there wasn't the Internet. There wasn't Facebook and Twitter and everything. Because it does seem a bit. Yeah, we're like, if today there was a movie about a bunch of, you know, people living in, I don't know, New York City. And somebody was like, oh, my God, did you see that? You know, Sabrina Carpenter and Taylor Swift showed up in the background of this movie. People be like, whoa, I better see that movie. Yeah, right. Yeah.

Nic

And I wonder if we have a skewed view now of the cultural significance of grunge at that actual time, because that's the cool stuff that survived. So we look back and we say, well, that's cool. So that must be what everyone thought would was cool. And in reality, at that time, the top two hits were probably like, Baby Baby by Amy Grant and Life is a Highway by Tom Cochran. So I don't think there was like, just a coolness that swept the nation just because Nirvana was out. So maybe that's part of it.

Steve

I think you're right. It's also interesting just to. To point out that this film was made in 1991. Cameron Crowe filmed it in Seattle, created, made the movie 1991. And then Warner Brothers just held onto it because they weren't sure what to do with it. And then in 1992, as grunge exploded, as Nirvana and Pearl Jam, and, you know, to a slightly lesser extent, Soundgarden, Nelson Chains exploded on the scene. And the Seattle sound and Sub Pop Records and all that became kind of, yeah, not only cool, but it became the mainstream. Right. It basically signaled the end of the hair metal era of rock music.

Nic

Right?

Steve

That's when Warner Brothers decided, okay, well, we've got this thing in our back pocket. Let's go and put it out there. So it. It was. It was ahead of its time in that it was prescient in its creation. And I don't think there's any chance anyone involved in making the movie, and certainly not Cameron Crowe thought to himself, I'm gonna have Chris Cornell walk up and just stand here next to Matt Dillon while this car stereo dest. And that's the guy who's going to end up writing Super Unknown and winning a thousand Grammys and like, you know what I mean? Like, cultural touchpoint, this cultural icon. There's no way, right? And two songs, Alison Chains gets to play two songs on stage. There's no way that. That, you know, was something that they were thinking about how, oh, boy, when. When these guys all get huge, this is really going to help VHS sales in this movie.

Nic

Yeah, this is. This is a weird analogy. And maybe it's just because of how I feel about Alice in Chains versus the other grunge bands of the era. But I feel like they're not as good to me as Soundgarden, Pearl Jam, Nirvana, any of that stuff. But they're the big ballers in this movie. They're like the big dogs in this movie. And it reminds me of. You can talk when I'm done. I was watching this documentary about Saturday Night Live Season 11, and they had this very weird cast, but full of a lot of people who became big stars later in life. So it was Robert Downey Jr. And Anthony Michael hall, and I don't know if Julia Louis Dreyfus, like, people who became big stars. And the whole thing was just about how, you know, who was unstoppable that year. Jon Lovitz. So I'm not calling Alice in Chains the Jon Lovitz of the grunge scene. You are, but, yeah, I think I am. Jon the Rooster Lovitz has a lot in common.

Steve

So let's take a step back to the early to mid-90s at this point and just. I'll say, I think everybody back then, at least among middle and early high school aged boys, at least, right, you had like A favorite grunge band if you're into the music at all. Unless you were just, I know I only listen to rapper only, whatever. Okay, fine. But if you liked the music at all, you had one of them that you were like, this one's mine. Alice in Chains was mine. Oh, okay. Alice in Chains was mine. I thought Dirt was one of the greatest albums, rock albums I ever heard. I still think Jar of Flies is. Is grunge's best artistic piece, like work of art, that the grunge Seattle sound, whatever, ever put out is the EP Jar of Flies by Alison Chain. So I'm a huge fan. When Lane Staley died, I was in college and I spent at least a day in despair over Lane Staley having died. So I'll try not to be offended. But you just said.

Nic

And you know what? At that time, I've come to appreciate a lot of that music, but I was not really into that when it was out, right? So I came to a lot of the 90s grunge stuff a little bit later. And one of my main experiences of it is now in my car. We have Sirius XM radio and there's the Lithium station, which is like the early 90s hits. And it seems like whenever I turn it on, it's Alison Chains.

Steve

Oh, that's funny.

Nic

I feel like Alice in Chains. There's something about the estate of Lane Staley and the power they have over the programmers at Sirius X and that I'm hearing a lot of them. So, yeah, I was not at the time, so I don't know how it would have touched me as an eighth grader. Full disclosure, my favorite musical artist when I was in this, like, heyday of all the best hip hop and grunge and stuff was Steve Winwood. So nobody should take take any music advice from me ever.

Steve

Oh, now that. I mean, you know, I saw Steve Winwood live once open for Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, and that was a show that both made me feel young and old. So anyway, okay, so let's jump into it. So obviously this movie is not. It's a character driven film. It is not a plot driven film. Not a lot happens. That's not to say that things don't happen or that, you know, literally like people to sit around talking. But I feel like this movie is very much in the vein of Richard Linklater Slacker and Kevin Smith's Clerks and to where it's a lot about the characters and their conversations and their relationships and the things they talk about in these little Vignettes. And I think this was a really common thing in common. But it was common enough in the early 90s, you know, that you did see movies like this fairly often from, like, younger filmmakers. Like Crow.

Nic

Was this Crow's first.

Steve

It was not his first movie. No, no, this was. I think this was his first passion project, though. I think he, like, you know, had had a small success under his belt when it came time to, like, do this movie, and that's why he was able to get it made. But then even. Even that wasn't enough to get Warner Brothers to just put it out in 1991 when it was done. You know, they had to wait. But, yeah, so. But we will try to walk through, I think, mostly because I think Nic and I are the same in that we write notes linearly as we're watching the movie, so we'll still kind of walk through it.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

And the first thing that I noticed on my. On this rewatch, because I have not seen the movie now in a few years, is that Louise, the character who sort of seduces one of our main characters, Linda, who I will later be referring to as Rachel. And I'll tell you all about why Linda meets Louise. And he's wearing five shirts and jackets, if you notice, when he walks up to her car, like, I get that it's Seattle, and so it's probably kind of chilly. And it's the 90s, so of course, layering was in. But dude's got, like, T shirt, polo shirt, oxford, like, work shirt, and jacket, like, all on. The number of collars on this guy's neck is, like, absolutely ludicrous. He looks like a football linebacker. And I was just, like. It immediately brought me back to, like. I don't think I ever wore only one shirt from, like, 1991 to 1997 or 98. Like, it was always at least layered up. Layered, like the polo, you know, with a T shirt underneath it. Or do you had to do something.

Nic

Yep.

Steve

Always layered.

Nic

Yep.

Steve

And I think that this really just shows how with the Zeitgeist, this film.

Nic

Really was classic, classic look. Yeah. And Luis, Yeah, that was a good character of the kind of Foreigner who seems very nice, and then you. You learn something about him that you don't like.

Steve

Yeah. Shouldn't really have come too much as a surprise because, you know, their little relationship zooms by us in probably five or six minutes. It's very fast. So clearly this is going to. I think, you know, the. The foreshadowing of the crash and burn is pretty Clear. And so of course, you know, Linda sees Louise at a, at a club with somebody else and, and cold blooded reaction, really.

Nic

He could have popped up and been like, oh. Even if he was like, oh, oh yeah, this is my cousin, she's here from out of town. You can't meet her because she doesn't speak in.

Steve

My plane was delayed. I mean something man like.

Nic

But he just looked at her kind of giving her the nod like you lost.

Steve

Which is, it was brutal.

Nic

Yeah, not, not a good move, Louise.

Steve

It was, it was brutal. And I think it was definitely. That was just, it was rough. And I think, you know, when you see her reaction as she basically decides that she's not going to date anymore. Right. And I think there's this, that really starts the trend because the next person we meet is Steve Dunn and he's telling us all about how he just broke up with a girlfriend and now he's not going to date anymore. He's going to focus on work. So of course those two have to get together because that's how these things work. But this running theme of 20somethings, because we get a sense, I don't think we hear everybody's age. We get a sense they're all going to 23 with 27. They're on that ballpark. Right. The running theme of 20 something's concerned with time running out. Right. I think Janet, who's 23 specifically talks about, I think time's running out to do something bizarre.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

Because once you hit 25, bizarre is just like irresponsible or something. So they're concerned with time running out. They're concerned with being alone forever. I feel like that was probably felt fresher at the time, but watching it now, it is insufferable.

Nic

It's really hard as somebody who's mid-40s whose time has run out. And I know what it's like to look back at somebody in their 20s and say, you son of a bitch, you have no idea what's ahead of you. If they're all feeling this sense of my time's running out, I need to do something different, then now's the time to act. And they're just existing still within this same 10 person ecosystem where they keep making the same bad decisions with different people. It's. It was pretty funny to see that.

Steve

Yeah, for sure. So we get so early on we see, we see we're introduced to Linda and she dates Luis and then is tossed aside. We meet her friend Ruth, who we don't really care about after this. She seemed like she was gonna be a major part.

Nic

Yeah, she just kind of dipped out.

Steve

She sort of somewhat disappeared, except as background in Linda's other scenes. But then we meet Steve and his buddy Bailey. Yep. Right. And Steve and Bailey are gonna go out and meet girls. And Bailey's got his watch that has. He can store 20 numbers in his watch.

Nic

Man. Technology.

Steve

I've never. I mean, I think I even had a calculator watch like that. I didn't know it stored phone numbers like that. Literally.

Nic

Yeah, I. You know, I think it's an instance of the movies inventing a technology that doesn't exist just to blow the audience mind and put them in a different world. That must have been a thing. Some watch that had, like, a minimum amount of data storage. You probably had to write out a name in numerical letters like you used to with pager code.

Steve

Right?

Nic

Yeah. And Bailey, who is one of my favorite characters in a different program.

Steve

Oh, interesting.

Nic

Bailey is in the Wire.

Steve

Oh.

Nic

So he plays Officer Prezbolowski in the Wire, who's a pretty, like, minor and not very likable character. Early in the show, he's just one of the dumb cops who does dumb things and gets himself in trouble.

Steve

Nice.

Nic

So he ends up. I think he.

Steve

And.

Nic

And he was also a classic fail son. I think he was like, hey, you better hire this guy because he's marrying my niece kind of thing. You know, it's kind of from the brass up top. And then his arc in that show was that later he got fired from the police department, became a teacher, like a fourth grade teacher or something. And he was in this season that was about the school system and was a very good kind of arc and a good turnaround. So whenever I see that guy, I only can think of that because he was just like, that show was just such a big thing and.

Steve

But here he's a soul patch wearing doofus.

Nic

I mean, do you think when he takes that dumb hat off, the soul patch always also comes off too, like it's attached?

Steve

Yeah, well, that or it's just. It's stick on. Yeah, it's definitely kind of fake or something. It's real bad.

Nic

I mean, look. And my history is not devoid of embarrassing headwear. I definitely owned my share of fedoras and such over the years. Yeah, I had my. My newsboy hat, but I've been a bald guy. I was 23. So really, that guy had a luscious head of hair that he was just absolutely obfuscating with that hat. I didn't I didn't like it.

Steve

It's not okay. It's not okay. So. So they're trying to go to this, I guess, club, right? They're going to party or whatever, and they need to ask directions. And who do they see? They see. Well, they initially say a clown, right? But he's clearly dressed up as a mime. And did you know who plays this mime?

Nic

I. So I thought at first and I was like, no, that wouldn't be. That doesn't make sense. But I was correct.

Steve

Yes.

Nic

Eric Stoltz.

Steve

Eric Stoltz. He's not just a mime, he's a shouting mime. Like, he's literally in the car just shouting at them. Most annoying thing ever. But wonderful appearance by Eric Stoltz, who I think I've never seen in something and not loved him in that thing.

Nic

He's pretty good. He's pretty good.

Steve

He's pretty awesome.

Nic

There's a gag as the mime, so they stop to ask him for directions. And then what happens is a bunch of people end up getting in their car with them because they're all going in the same place. And there's a scene where he pantomimes bringing a cigarette to his lips and pulling it away and then blows out actual smoke, which is just one of those magic of the movies type things where I just. I really, really love that. Like, props to Cameron Crowe. That's an excellent gag.

Steve

Absolutely. That's good stuff. So, yeah, so that's. That's the. They finally find their way to this party, Right? And I believe that's where Allison Chains is performing on stage. And my understanding is a little outside of the movies. Reality. Reality is that that venue had the real life, real world name of the OK Hotel. And in early 1992 or late 1991, that actually late 1991, a few months after the movie was done filming, that is where Nirvana played Smells Like Teen Spirit in public for the first time. Oh, so that was a real venue up there in Seattle where real music history was made. Obviously not while they were filming this movie, but, you know, but Allison Chains to get to play a couple songs. So that was fun for me at least.

Nic

Yeah. I mean, hey, and look, I. I can be convinced I'm not locked into my. I can unlock the chains of my Alice in Chains opinion if I need to at that concert. This is when Steve first notices Linda and he decides to approach her, which, as anyone, would you see someone you're interested in talking to at a concert that everybody wants to be at and listen to you walk over to them in the middle of a song and shout the lamest game anybody's ever heard in their life. Yeah, this was a big 90s kind of. I feel like this is a big Gen X movie thing where you're. Where you're kind of doing a. A meta. You're meta. Hitting on someone.

Steve

You're right.

Nic

Oh, I'm not the kind of guy who would come over and say something and it was just, it was hard to watch at the time. Maybe it was cool and innovative.

Steve

No, I don't think it was. I think it was never cool. And I think that's why Linda calls him out on it right then. Right. You know, he's saying something like, well, my friend said, you got to play a character. You can't be yourself, so I'm not playing a character. And she said, oh, you are. Your character is the I'm not playing a character guy. And it's like, yeah, that's, that's accurate. That was the first moment where I really felt like it certainly doesn't come down at any point during the film. I really felt like, why does Steve Dunn feel like an Aaron Sorkin character? He really feels like Sam Seaborn or something. Like. And west, you know, he really. He's. He's too, his vocabulary is too purple. He, he's just, he's. There's something so like insufferably annoying. Yeah. About him in a way that, you know, is not intentional. He's not being played for laughs. He's not, you know, he's not intended to be. I mean, Campbell Scott's a notoriously sort of like serious actor that at times apparently was very hard to work with on this movie. But it's like, what. This guy is super irritating and he's just. I don't get him as a main character lead.

Nic

The lead romantic.

Steve

Right.

Nic

Well, I don't know. Maybe. Maybe Kara Sedgwick is the lead. I guess that's debatable. But I mean, the lead male romantic role anyway. And yeah, he's not. I couldn't imagine women watching this movie at the time and thinking, oh, that's, that's the guy. That's the guy I like.

Steve

Right.

Nic

He just, yeah, he's. He's very off putting from the very beginning.

Steve

He's like a proto nice guy. Like, I don't think nice guys, the way we understand them today really exist or they existed in the 90s, but we didn't recognize them for the sort of nefariously, the misogynistic kind of weirdness that they would bring. And I don't mean this in like people who are literally nice. I mean guys who have to tell you over and over again, I'm a nice guy.

Nic

Oh, yeah, right.

Steve

He's basically an incel who gets laid.

Nic

Okay. Yeah. And the proto nice guy thing going to even what he does for a living and stuff. So this is a, this is an on paper great guy. Yep, this is a guy. I'm trying to build a high speed rail super train. I'm building a super train. And you know, I like just personally I'm glad that all got built. I'm glad we figured that out back in 1991 because, you know, guys like Steve really did it. But yeah, so they all kind of have these jobs. Like the way I see this movie is him, Steve and Linda both. Anyway, they have these positions where she's at some kind of environmental organization and then he's trying to get the trains built. So they're doing good people things, but they're acting very kind of selfishly and I don't know, like they're, they're not like generous people. They're people who are doing what they think a good person would do, but not necessarily acting generously or.

Steve

Right. Yeah. And his. When he finally calls her to get together, it's like the most pathetic call ever. Right. It's like, can we get dinner? Oh, you already. How you're busy. Oh, can we get lunch? Or you already have like a lunch with you. Whatever. Or you're already going to lunch. Can we get a drink or can we get a coffee? How about water? How about I show up to where you're having lunch and we'll have water? I've just never heard anything so ludicrous.

Nic

Like I was getting Jon Favreau and Swinger's vibes.

Steve

Yes. Oh my God.

Nic

The way that he was leaving these voice messages over and over for the woman, it felt it was kind of a cross between that and then John Candy and Planes, Trains and Automobiles trying to get Steve Martin's character trying to apologize. Can I buy you a beer? How about a hot dog? Tic Tacs? What? You know, going through that whole thing.

Steve

But when they go to lunch though, did you notice who is next to them? So they go to lunch.

Nic

There's like the hottest makeout scene in film.

Steve

The most horrific mouth sounds ever that I've ever heard. Just sucking sounds coming from next to them. And they turn and who, who is it? That's. That's that's standing there, the real heartthrob.

Nic

Of the film, Paul Giamatti.

Steve

Paul Jiamatti, who just looks up from his face. Face sucking and just goes, what? That's it. That's one word in the whole movie.

Nic

Very funny. Very funny. To see a Giamatti with that kind of curly blonde hair in the scene and dressed that way and everything. Yeah, that was. That was a highlight for me for sure. I have Giamatti make out scene written.

Steve

Down here in my notes. Much like in our first movie that we talked about together, Nic, Groundhog Day, with Michael Shannon making his screen debut. This was Paul Giamatti's first screen credit.

Nic

Okay.

Steve

First time he was ever on screen in something, you know, at least produced in this. In this manner. So that's cool. So we've talked a little bit about Steve and Linda.

Nic

Yep.

Steve

Let's switch gears a little bit because there's a lot of characters in this movie. What do you think of Janet? We first meet Janet. She is, I believe when we first meet her, we see her working at the coffee shop, the Java something I can't remember they call it now. Regardless, she's working there. She tells us she's 23, she's afraid of turning 25 and her life ending, basically. And she is in love with Cliff. Yeah. Who is Matt Dillon's character. He is the classic, you know, I'm a dude in a band, long hair, another sort of soul patch, sort of a little bit of chin pubes or whatever going on. And he's just too cool for school. And he's the lead singer and guitarist for a song called. For a band named Citizen Dick. And. And of course, who. I'll let you tell everybody who the who. The rest of the band of Citizen Dick. Are you aware?

Nic

Well, I just. I know the drummer of Citizen Dick is Eddie Vedder.

Steve

That's right.

Nic

And who are the other band members?

Steve

Betters. Pearl Jam and Mookie Blaylock. Bandmates. Jeff Ament and Stone Gossert play the other two members.

Nic

Nice.

Steve

They were playing themselves because at a scene later in the film. We'll just jump ahead a little bit. Again, this movie kind of bounces around, so following it linearly doesn't make sense. Anyway, later on they have gone to play. I think they've played a show or they're going to play show in Portland, but they're looking at a review of their latest show. Cliff does not want to hear any negative anything. So Eddie Vedder, his drummer, is reading the. The review and he goes oh, and this is you about Cliff Pontier. Whatever. You know, he's. Oh, I want to hear anything negative. So they kind of have to start scanning to look for anything positive, and there's nothing. It's saying how awful Cliff is, and they really should be in LA and he doesn't belong here and all this stuff. Until they get to the point, we go, oh, he was. As always, Cliff is reliably backed up by bandmates Eddie Vedder, Jeff. So I think myself, these guys are actually playing themselves, sort of. It's very interesting, me. Like, I thought, why didn't they give them character names? It was just kind of an interesting choice. I think that, yeah, that is themselves.

Nic

This movie, though, it toed the line with breaking the fourth Wall and just kind of existing outside of the movie and stuff with people talking directly to the camera and then things like that. So the names thing normally wouldn't make sense, but in the context of the movie, it's like, this is a weird. It's a weird movie. They make weird choices.

Steve

Chris Cornell is in it because Soundgarden plays at that same venue later in the movie. Or maybe it's a different venue, but later in the movie, after Steve and Linda have broken up, after the horrible thing that happened, which we can talk about in a minute. But, like, Cornell plays, the Soundgarden plays there. They play Birth Ritual. Great song. But before that, we saw Soundgarden lead man Chris Cornell, just kind of. I guess he lives there at their little complex. It says there's 18 units, and we see it's a rather large place when we. When we get an aerial shot later. But really we focused on, you know, the occupants of maybe four of the. Of the apartments. So I guess he lives there because he comes out and he watches. You know, Cliff has. Has tried to make up with Janet, and he's installed a new stereo in her car, but it gets so loud, it breaks the windows. It's a pretty dumb scene, frankly. And. And he's standing there watching it, and it's like. I guess that is just supposed to be Chris Cornell being Chris Cornell, because his band Soundgarden, plays a Soundgarden song later in the movie.

Nic

Right?

Steve

So it's just an interesting. Like you said, there is this sort of. And then you combine that with all the fourth wall breaking, which is almost incessant. Very, very common to just have characters to start talking. I mean, Cliff spends the last five minutes of the movie just talking to us to sort of make sure we're all aware of what's happened, which isn't much. It does kind of straddle the line between, well, what's real in reality and what's real in this movie. And where do they. Where does that separation occur?

Nic

Yeah, yeah. Going back to Steve and Linda real quick. So Linda, you know, she has this job at the environmental agency. This is kind of. They mention it a lot in the movie. I think the characters are all kind of classic 1990s environmentalist types, which is, which is great. It's very funny. When he gets to her car, he walks her to her car and he refers to it as a gas guzzling monster. And it's not like a truck or van. It's like a Plymouth Acclaim sedan that probably got 25 city, 28 highway miles per gallon back then. I need. I was trying to get a shot of what the actual car was so I could find out what the fuel economy was, just to see how funny that would be compared to, you know, what's available today.

Steve

It did seem to have that. I think it was the old Plymouth or was it the Chrysler? It was one of those windows looked like an old minivan that my mom had. But yeah, yeah, it was definitely. I mean, it's a big car. A lot of the characters drive very compact, very small vehicles. And it certainly is sort of a land boat that she has. So maybe it's a little out of, you know, because she also makes a comment when she first learns that Steve is working on the Super Train, is that. Well, she's like, oh, I love my car though, you know, and that sort of comes up a couple times.

Nic

Right. Does keep coming up.

Steve

Do you do how Environment. I mean, not that like, you know, you, I don't know, like you can love things and still want to make things better. Like, I'm not saying you can't, but it is a little interesting. Like I feel like today somebody working at like an environmental advocacy organization wouldn't be driving a V8 pickup. And it feels very much like the corollary of the time. And it is odd and I think it's strange. And the funny part is I think it's strange, but they also don't really. There's that one kind of throwaway comment about it and it's like never mentioned. It's not really a thing. We never examine that part of Linda.

Nic

It's almost like they feel. I feel like I have to say something in my position as a, quote, good person that I'm establishing for myself. I feel like this is something I need to say. Otherwise I'm not doing my job, but I don't have to pursue caring about it.

Steve

It. Exactly. Can we talk about Debbie?

Nic

Let's talk about Debbie.

Steve

Let's talk about Debbie. So Debbie's the only person in this little apartment building, it seems, that has a roommate. She has Pam. Pamela. Pammy is her roommate. And she is. She seems to have a pretty good job. It seems like she had. It's funny because she's the only. The roommate. But she also seems to be. She has more money than the others. Seems like.

Nic

Seems like the most financially career successful one out of the group. But yeah, it is odd that she has the roommate, I think. Yeah. Just to add some tension or something.

Steve

Right. Well, it comes up later because her main sort of put. She's. She. So we've got, you know, basically Linda and Steve are sort of matched up for the movie. Cliff and Janet are kind of matched up for the movie. Bailey is just there. He's tertiary at best. And then Debbie kind of has her own plot, but she doesn't really have a guy. Yeah, right. At least not in the main cast. So she's doing video dating called Expect the Best. And I'm wondering if you recognized the man who was tapped to do her video. She shows up for the video shoot to do the video dating.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

And they talk about, oh, this guy's gonna make her. Did you know who that was?

Nic

Yeah, I did. It took me a minute. And it's one of those people. I'm not always sure what they look like, but yeah. That was director Tim Burton.

Steve

That was director Tim Burton and he is the next Martin Scorsese, according to.

Nic

I love that. I love the mispronunciation of score horses.

Steve

But yeah, so she gets this just absolutely ridiculous, sort of avant garde in all the worst ways kind of video dating video made for her. And then she, you know, really. It's funny. She really betrays the trope later on. So she. So let me. I'm skipping ahead of myself. She does this. She puts it out there, and then she gets a bunch of responses. And so she asks all of her friends, hey, which of these guys should I, you know, go out with? Right. There's like six maybe. And most of them are kind of odd. Yep. But of course, the one that isn't is Peter Horton, who I will always. For me, I know he was in like 30 something, a bunch of other movies and TV shows, but for me, he will always be washed up beach volleyball superstar Zach Barnes of side Out. And if you haven't seen that movie at some point we will, but yeah, so Peter Horton is, is this bicycle aficionado who, you know, she decides to choose and to go on a date with and she shows herself as a relationship chameleon before she even starts the relationship. Oh yeah, because she shows up to the restaurant. Turns out that's the wrong one. But she shows up in a full like early 90s hot pink neon bike shorts and the helmet and the, the whole whatever she looks like she's part of the peloton. You know, it's like it's the whole deal and it's just the most ridiculous thing.

Nic

It reminded me of the scene in Super Troopers where the guy shows up to the. In his biker. Right Outfit and it's the cyclist outfit, not the motorcycle biker. Yeah, yeah, very funny. And it's too bad because Debbie seems like the character that might have the most going for her in the first place and maybe needs to do that kind of thing the least. It's a very desperate. Just the ridiculousness of all these people in their mid-20s feeling such desperation that they're not locked down for life is very funny.

Steve

But I think we can examine that for a second because I think this is how this movie shows us Generation X. Right. And really in the popular culture, like I said mentioned Richard Linklater's Slacker. That certainly had an impact on what Gen X got defined as in the greater culture. And this movie certainly is part of that. Reality bites. There's a handful of others and I think what they were saying basically is like for Gen X, if you're going to be cool, you either have to be like Janet and Cliff or cool because they're aloof or you have to be cool like Steve and Linda where you've got jobs and you're like being a productive member of society, but only in the way that, that it's like ecological or you know, you're working for the environment or you're doing this kind of like greater good stuff.

Nic

Right, right.

Steve

Because I believe Debbie is an advertising salesperson working. She says I'm working for a local, I think maybe TV station or radio station, but either way, you know, she's in media buying, basically an ad buying and media. And it's like that's not cool. Right, right. That's a square job. Right. She's working for the man. That's a square job. And so I think that she is this really heavy handed reminder that the trappings of success don't mean anything to Gen X man. And it's Ridiculous. And it's stupid and childish.

Nic

No, that. That makes a lot of sense. And the, the difference of her job versus the other ones where it's like Cliff being a musician, obviously that's cool. Steve and Linda, you talked about even Janet working at a coffee shop. It's. There's this kind of idea of a noble struggle.

Steve

Right.

Nic

So that's a cool job to have culturally.

Steve

You either worked in retail or in food service, or you didn't. Yeah, right. And it's like. And people our age, ish. That worked in retail or worked in food service, like, have this battle scar of like, understanding of what it's like to have to deal with the general public. And there's something noble about that. And there is something. And I'm not being facetious, like there literally is. And I feel like everybody in their life. Life should have to work either retail or some kind of food service to get that viewpoint. And I think this is. That's what makes Janet noble, right? Is that she's in that food service world. She's there to serve the public. And then the fact that it's Seattle and it's coffee, that's a cool factor thing. Right. This is still pre Starbucks being everywhere. Right. There was a sort of a mystique around the Pacific Northwest, and coffee was cool and espresso was cool and whatever. Yeah. So I think that's why. That's why Janet, like, can have kind of like an otherwise normal ish job and still be cool like Cliff.

Nic

Right.

Steve

You know, whatever.

Nic

Right. Right. So, yeah, no, that. That's a great point. And I mean, I see this in my life all the time, is you can definitely spot the people who have and who have not had to have a public facing job like that at some point.

Steve

Yeah. So.

Nic

So what did Janet. I mean, Janet felt. Felt uncomfortable in her relationship with Cliff because she felt inadequate.

Steve

Well, to be fair to her, Cliff kind of made it clear. Right. I mean, it's like looking whenever we're in Cliff's apartment, the walls are just plastered with like pages from Playboy and bikini models and kind of stuff. And it's quite ludicrous. Like this. This man we're supposed to understand. Is it probably 25 years old? Like, I'm guessing, but it's probably in that ballpark. I mean, I know what my apartment looked like when I was 25. Yeah, that's ridiculous. There's no way it was anything like that. I think I had like one or two movie posters up because I didn't want it to look cluttered, you know what I mean? Like, that's a ridiculous way to live.

Nic

That shows him as being, you know, he's 25, but in his mind he's actually 16.

Steve

He acts like a teenage boy, but. Yeah, but then because Janet straight up asks him, like, are my boobs big enough for you? And I think he said, sometimes I think, yes.

Nic

It was a very unsatisfying answer because it was like, like dishonest but also hurtful at the same time. He really killed it with that answer.

Steve

It was the short end of both sticks. It was like, dude, like, either lie to her and just make her feel better and lie or be totally honest and just be totally honest, right?

Nic

He's like, oh, I just have Playboy pictures because the small boob nudie magazines have all gone out of business because small boobs suck. But anyway, yeah, I love you.

Steve

Yeah, you're great. Yeah. She decides, and this is an interesting, I think thing that is only kind of hinted at rather than said outright, is that, you know, we heard very quickly throw away. I think it was as Steve was introducing, or not introducing, but talking about all of his neighbors to Linda when she first comes over and you know, she mentioned, he mentions Debbie and Bailey and Cliff and Janet. And he says, janet's saving up. She's working the coffee shop. She's saving up money to go back to architecture school. So then when Janet decides, no, I need to get my boobs done, I mean, I didn't really think about it until I thought about it, but it's like she's going to waste her, her savings, her architecture tuition savings on fake boobs for Cliff. Oh, man, that's dark.

Nic

Yeah, that's no good. That's no good, man. Architecture, I feel like in fiction is a very popular profession. And I wonder if it's because those tubes are such good props. Like, so much can happen, you know, like in the Brady Bunch of tables, the plans fall out of the end of the tube. The drafting tables are cool. You don't have a computer screen. It's just such a camera friendly profession.

Steve

It's true. Yeah. They say that's why you never have people in TV shows and movies who are writers, because what they do does not is not visually interesting. I mean, there are movies and stuff about writers. I mean, wrong, but you don't tend to show writers doing a lot of work.

Nic

Right.

Steve

Because it's like, what's the point? But, but, but an architect. Not that we actually see Janet do it, but it is an interesting thing. You write Another.

Nic

And then they have their, their main work that they're doing. So you have your architecture you're doing for your company, but then in your apartment or your office you have a very intricate model of your dream project. That's like your passion project. Yes, this is George Bailey and it's a wonderful life with his, his bridge or whatever that he smashes up when he's so frustrated. So it's just. That's another great prop to have.

Steve

Yeah, for sure. So, yeah. So she decides to go. She's going to get her boobs done. She goes and she meets Dr. Bill Pullman to go and, and get, I guess evaluated. And they go back and forth with this computer program, which I think is hilarious that the doctor's letting the patient touch the computer. But yeah, going back and forth with like she wants them super big. He's like, well, you could dial it back a little. No, no, no, super big. And they eventually split the difference, which is like, no, lady. Like, listen to the doctor. Like he's telling you he does this for a living. He's a professional. You probably should. Should pay attention. But yeah, but it. Thankfully, Janet decides later on after. After a riveting pep talk by Dr. Bill Pullman decides not to do it. Yeah, saves her money. Does not. Wants Cliff to love her for her. Makes the right call. But an interesting thing is, I don't really know what this sequence was meant to tell us because Janet enters and exits the sequence of this movie. Basically the exact same. I mean, I guess not true. She realizes that she wants Cliff to like her for herself and that's what it took, I guess. But it felt very like Much Ado about nothing.

Nic

It was. And the great gag, like you said, the back and forth with the computer man, we had limited graphics to really tell. You know, you're going to make this life changing decision. And this is like your character modification screen on RBI baseball. And that's the level of graphics that we have. But Bill Pullman coming on to her, really, really unprofessional. Although his or setup. So she went there ostensibly to get the operation and she's just sitting, no gown, nothing, just sitting on a random couch and he just has a little tray of scalpels and stuff as if you get breast implants. And then you're just, oh, on your way. Oh, make sure you don't drink any water for 20 minutes. Like you're leaving the dentist. I thought it was very funny that they're trying to set this up as she's there ready for the surgery and then she just, just leave. She's ready to go because I'm still in my clothes and.

Steve

Right. I'm gonna go out, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that was not a sterile environment.

Nic

I, you know, I don't think it was. It was a morally or, or medically sterile environment.

Steve

That's fair. I actually was watching that scene over again though, this, this watch through and I, I really, for a second I thought, wait, do they hook up? Because I feel like Janet and Dr. Bill Pullman should have gotten together.

Nic

Right?

Steve

I don't know. Why not? I mean, yes, he's 33, she's 23. I guess that's a big age gap, but like, not for a doctor. Yeah, that's fair.

Nic

You can make a spin off movie of Bill Pullman, the plastic surgeon who hates big boobs. So he has to go in every day and he's like, oh man, I hate. I wish they'd stay small. And that's like a good internal struggle for a character.

Steve

It would beg the question why he doesn't just, you know, do something else.

Nic

But hey, he feels trapped as well. If we go back to Steve and Linda. Yeah, because I had a few notes about this during his whole initial pursuit where again, insane soccer type behavior, like, can I take you out for drinks? How about dinner? How about a snack? How about a water? How about it? Terrible, terrible, terrible. And then when he finally gets her to agree to spend some time with him, he's immediately trying to give her his garage door opener. Which is funny because the last film we talked about, toy soldiers, involved a very prominent garage door opener. We're in our garage door opener era here. So the note that I had and Linda, this was the two notes that I had. Call the police on Steve. This movie. The message that this movie gives to stalkers is, hey, there's always a chance, man. Just keep trying, just keep going, just keep going.

Steve

Stay the course.

Nic

But then there's a scene right around the time where Steve was just being ridiculous and she was not repelling him in the way that I feel like she should have. She was sitting on her couch, brushing her teeth. No water, just brushing her teeth with paste and a brush, sitting on her couch. And I felt like, okay, there's something wrong with this one. She's not gonna, if she doesn't even know which room to brush her teeth in, then she's not gonna pick the right guy.

Steve

My 6 year old daughter will walk down the hallway with her toothbrush and her Mouth, brush her teeth and try to talk to her brother. And I'll be like, you can't do that. If you're doing that, you're not brushing. Go back in there and take care of your teeth.

Nic

Keep it in the bathroom. But they ultimately hooked up. Despite all this. They ultimately hooked up. Very, very funny scene. She made a comment earlier to Steve about the Seattle SuperSonics player Xavier McDaniel, the X Man. And he would not hear anything about anything negative. That' favorite player. And during the sex scene, it flashes into Steve's internal thoughts, which is Xavier McDaniel, which I love this gag. Again, very, very funny thing in the movie. And he's talking, and then he looks and he says, steve, don't come yet.

Steve

Well, because she asks him, what are you thinking? Right. In that movie? And it's clear that he's. And I look, I be honest. I think we men, we've all been there at some point. You're just trying. Yeah. To make everything last as long as it could.

Nic

Yes.

Steve

And that's not always easy. So thinking about something that is in no way sexy is sometimes a help.

Nic

Right.

Steve

And, yeah, I couldn't think of anything less sexy than the X Man telling me not to come yet.

Nic

I mean, God, the classic one is, you know, think about baseball and everything. But I think, as we discussed earlier, Paul Giamatti is in this movie. His father, A. Bartlett Giamatti, the Major League baseball commissioner, just died, like, the year before.

Steve

Oh, wow.

Nic

So maybe they just didn't want to talk about. Talk about baseball in this movie.

Steve

I'm sure that factor was a top. Cameron Crows.

Nic

I love the, the amount of love between Pearl Jam naming their band Mookie Blaylock and then the presence of Xavier McDaniel and stuff. I, I the Seattle basketball, like, there's some real fandom there.

Steve

It was nice to see the Sonics fans still exist. Sonics fans are still pissed about the Sonics moving to Oklahoma City. They are still upset about, you know, Kevin Durant was drafted.

Nic

He was drafted by the songs right.

Steve

Before the Sonics moved and then became Kevin Durant and the superstar that he, that he became in Oklahoma City. So they're still upset about. And I don't blame him, frankly, to date this, this recording, as an A's fan who has recently lost his team. Like, I don't blame Seattle basketball fans for still being heard about it.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

And I think, you know, it. It's. That was a big thing. And they didn't have, I mean, they had the Mariners And I guess they had the Mariners in. The Seahawks. They had a lot of sports in Seattle, but yeah, something about the basketball team really, really touched people.

Nic

The Seahawks, though, this was kind of like post Bosworth, so they were really struggling.

Steve

Brian Boswell, post Largent. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Nic

But I love. So the. Him needing to picture Xavier McDaniel telling him not to come. Very funny. Steve goes into the. The store. I think he was getting the. They had a scare.

Steve

Right.

Nic

So.

Steve

So Linda. Linda's late. So. So now. Now Linda's thinks she might be pregnant. She actually seems pretty confident that she is. So. Yeah. So Steve goes to the drugstore to get apparently every other pregnancy test that exists.

Nic

Yeah, I couldn't. I didn't know what his strategy was.

Steve

I thought.

Nic

I thought he was trying to dilute the pregnancy test with a bunch of other random stuff, but I think he got a whole bunch of.

Steve

It seems like it was all pregnancy tests. Yeah. So he had like seven or eight of them, and it was just. Yeah. Randomly flipping them very nonchalantly off. As a father, he should not have been so nonchalant. This was like a massive moment in his life.

Nic

He wasn't reading the backs of the boxes or anything. He was just going off vibes.

Steve

Yeah.

Nic

But the cashier at the drugstore. Great, great appearance. And I don't know. I didn't see if this was his first appearance, but I feel like it's very early for him.

Steve

You know, I don't know either, but I think. Yeah, definitely early on, but he was mentioned in the opening credits, so I don't think so because, like, Jamati, for instance, didn't. Didn't get an opening credits call. But Jeremy Piven was listed in the opening credits. And yeah, he. He was fantastic.

Nic

Jeremy Piven, just the baldest young guy. He's just so acutely bald in a way that is. You don't see it a lot. I think that's when, as a bald man myself, you're as well shaving your head with clippers. I feel like maybe they weren't as prevalent in the 90s because that look of the balding, early mid-20s guy who's still trying to rock the haircut just doesn't exist anymore. And Piven looked older there than he did in a lot of the Entourage episodes and stuff. I mean, there's something about it that ages you. But very funny scene.

Steve

You've also perfectly described my wedding photos. That was. That was the look I was rocking.

Nic

Oh, yeah, that look.

Steve

Oh, man. Not good. Yeah, not good. Should have been. Should have been shaving it down earlier, but. Yeah.

Nic

But if I could wake up tomorrow and have one day with that haircut, I would definitely take it.

Steve

Fair enough. Yeah. So he is buying pregnancy tests. And real quick, I don't know if you saw this in. In researching anything before coming here to do this. Jeremy Piven apparently cost production a significant amount of money because he ad libbed all that stuff about Public Enemy and. Oh, God, what was it now? It was. It was blending.

Nic

Oh, the mashup of the song. Yes.

Steve

He kept doing song lyrics from both songs. They end up having to pay ASCAP fees for those songs. And so he ended up costing them a few. I mean, not like astronomical, but like, you know, his day rate was probably 500 bucks. Yeah. Or 700 bucks. Something in that ballpark. And he ended up costing them thousands of dollars in. In licensing fees.

Nic

Oh, that is because they.

Steve

They didn't want to, like, reshoot it because it's a good scene and it's a very funny moment and Piven's great, but apparently that was. It costs a production a little extra money.

Nic

As an actor, I think Piven recognized the limitations of Campbell Scott's on screen charisma and was like, I really. I. I gotta pull a lot of weight here.

Steve

So. Yeah. So he goes and he buys the pregnancy tests. They take them and they go through the Mr. Wizard fucking chemistry set. That is early 90s pregnancy tests.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

Side note, my wife and I are rewatching a TV show that we love called Glow. I don't know if you've.

Nic

The wrestling show.

Steve

The wrestling show. The women's wrestling show set in the 80s and a character in that show has to take a pregnancy test. And it's even more of life like a series of beakers and. And a Bunsen burner and craziness. Like, it's an. Absolutely. I don't know how people did this, but. Yeah. So they have to like pour two vials into each other and wait to see. And it was so funny that they're looking for blue liquid. They say, well, hold up something blue behind it. I'm thinking myself, that's the dumbest thing. Yeah. Possibly do all look blue. They realize that and put up something white. Sure enough, it's the brightest blue liquid you've ever seen.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

It's like those adult diaper commercials from the 90s where there was pouring blue liquid.

Nic

Pitcher full of blue.

Steve

Oh, my God. And so. So she's pregnant. So Linda's pregnant.

Nic

It was funny that the, the camera Was only showing kind of their faces and them kind of. Is it blue?

Steve

I don't know.

Nic

I don't know. A good gag. Again, when it finally shows it, I'm colorblind and I could see that that's blue from miles away.

Steve

It was pretty clear.

Nic

Really good.

Steve

Yeah. So, yeah. So they, they have to decide what they're gonna do. And you know, they decide and let's keep it. And he actually even proposes to her.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

Which is crazy because it just is. But that's what he decides to do.

Nic

Yeah. He sees this as, okay, I figured my stuff out, I can do my bullet train. And now I got my life figured out and things are gonna be happy forever. And let's go for a little drive to celebrate.

Steve

Yeah. I don't know where they're gonna drive to, but they're driving. And this was actually good because I knew the scene was coming, this moment was coming. But I don't know how surprising it was to you to have that happen where Linda and Steve are driving down the street and they're hit by a truck. It's like a gardening landscaping company pickup truck. But I noticed this time through because I think it did catch me by surprise the first time I watched the movie. This time through, you can actually, in the cut, before they cut to Steve, before they cut back to Linda, where the crash happens out Linda's window, you can see that truck barreling down the street and kind of coming towards the intersection, which I thought was really interesting, was a great timing, good editing, I think, you know, but then Steve's comment is that lights yellow for way too long. And it's like, I know you work for the Department of Transportation, so I get that you might have some insight into this. But like, do you know this intersection that well? And here's the thing. If that lights yellow, the cross traffic's got a red.

Nic

Right. They can't both be right.

Steve

So it's not like you're coming up to an intersection. It was very strange. It wouldn't have mattered. That light could have been green. Right. And if that truck was going to come barreling into that intersection at that time, it was running a red no matter what. It was such a weird kind of thing where they. I feel like it tried to explain the crash to us in his little comment, but it doesn't make any sense. Like they just got barreled in a T boned by somebody running a red light.

Nic

Well, I think it's a. It's a classic high speed train enthusiast trying to bash the Automobile industry and make it look bad.

Steve

That must be it. They lost a baby and it obviously screws up their relationship. And I don't. I, you know, I think it makes sense why. I think this was like a. An earned sort of hard thing for them to do, like awkwardness and. And, you know, I did feel like this was a part of this movie where, you know, this horrible thing happened to these two people. You know, it seems like they had just wanted. They were close to figuring it out kind of thing with each other. And this sort of throws everything off. And so she decides to go off on a trip to sort of like an ecological research trip to Alaska. And he's gonna, you know, try to get this thing passed with the mayor, played by Tom Skerritt, I believe was the other, like, kind of cameo. Yeah, but. Yeah, and that's. And that's kind of, you know, where, you know, I think they should have left Linda and Steve.

Nic

Yeah, I mean, that, that was. That made sense. And like you said it for him to propose and like, want to stay with her, that made sense. But it was definitely absent the pregnancy way jumping the gun and never would have happened. So this is all hinging upon and we have a baby to deal with and this is the best thing to do. And then when Linda loses the baby. Okay, that should be it. So she goes off on her research trip. And then we get a very sad montage of Steve's terrible life in depressing Seattle as a single man, where it's like, sad. And he's building a high speed rail and he's watching Soundgarden at like a 45 person venue and he's meeting all these beautiful people. It's like, Steve, nobody feels bad for you right now.

Steve

No, he needed to just move on with his life. I did love the. The classic. It's a trope now, but, you know, might have felt more fresh than. But it was great that, you know, he leaves this. Honestly, it's better for him. But he leaves this ridiculous message on her machine, pouring his heart out and I'll never call again, don't worry, or whatever, but, like trying to be again the nice guy. Yeah. And she comes in, of course, just as the machine, you know, was finished with his message and beeping. And she goes to check it and what does the machine do? It eats the tape. It eats the tape. Classic. That just happens all the time. I, you know, I grew up, we had tapes in answering machines. I don't think ever once that happened.

Nic

No.

Steve

Any one of our answering Machines.

Nic

You needed a really messed up tape player for that to happen. I mean, it's very rare.

Steve

So. Yeah, there you go.

Nic

Maybe an old Teddy Ruxpin would eat. But not. Not a real player. So Steve's kind of fallen. He's kind of done. The mayor, like you said, he has this meeting with the mayor. He finally gets to pitch his high speed rail. So he's ready to put. It's funny. It doesn't go in front of the citizens of Seattle. They're just like, I talk to this one guy one on one, and that'll decide. Or not.

Steve

Yeah.

Nic

So he tells him no. And then Steve is kind of done with his. He's over it, right?

Steve

Yeah.

Nic

He doesn't care about it anymore and he leaves his work.

Steve

He quits his job, I guess. Yeah. We're not even. It's not even really made clear until later when he talks about sending out resumes over fast, which. Yeah, ridiculous. But. But yeah. So apparently he quits his job and. And why did his cubicle collapse?

Nic

That was so funny. And if just one side collapsed, it would have been funny, but it just kept going until it was all the way collapsed. I really love that. Just another thing that made this movie more interesting for me where there's just a couple gags that are like. It doesn't serve the plot, but it's just so ridiculous. And it makes this movie more enjoyable.

Steve

But it's also like, it definitely. It was fun. I'm not, like, bad, but it's like, was he never coming back for all that stuff? Cubicle was just chock full of, like, plants and coffee mugs and, like, different things he's done.

Nic

You get whatever fits in your one box, and then that's it. That's all you ever get. Yeah. So then he's. He's on his sad guy.

Steve

Right.

Nic

And it's kind of going back and forth and showing what's happening with Linda. What's happening with Steve.

Steve

Right.

Nic

Linda is back together with her boring ex, which it had flashed back to before. Just sitting there.

Steve

Sensitive ponytail guy. Yeah.

Nic

Just classic guy. That's. That's a classic 90s trope guy. I like him.

Steve

Absolutely.

Nic

And they're just boringly doing crosswords in the same room together, not speaking or anything. And then Steve's downfall is just. He's basically turned into a renegade cop who plays by his own rules. He just wakes up in a haze of beer cans and pizza boxes every morning. And then added on top of that, because he's a train guy. He has has the sad, kind of Reverend Lovejoy style model train set going through his apartment as he's just lamenting the loss of everything in his life. And I really like that. I wonder how long could he sustain himself in that lifestyle before he found a new job? Like, did he have savings just for going sad guy for a couple months?

Steve

I feel like probably again, I think, you know, it's a little tough to tell with all these people living in this in the same. You know, basically it's an apartment building where Linda, who works the coffee shop, Cliff, who works multiple jobs, but all of them sort of, you know, he works the coffee shop, he works delivering flowers and of course has the band, and then Debbie who works in ad sales with a roommate. They can all afford an apartment here. So I don't get a good sense of like, this must not be a very expensive place. If Janet can afford to live here alone on a. On a barista's salary or, you know, wages. It's probably not a super expensive place. So one would think a government job pays decent, you know, so you're not going to get rich working for the government, but you're never going to go. Go broke either, you know. Well, he had a sob.

Nic

Classic 90s. Yeah, that was. That was a good detail as well.

Steve

So he must have some savings a bit and. And was able to. He probably could have done that for a while because it was obviously all getting delivery because he made a comment when Janet comes over to check on him, he makes a comment about like, oh, in today's day and age, you don't even need to leave the house. And I'm thinking to myself, dude, doordash wouldn't be invented for like 20 more years. At 25 more years at least.

Nic

That was really funny.

Steve

But, you know, but he's clearly got its pizza and Chinese food. He's just getting the things that have always been delivered. Right. You could get those delivery dating back to the 60s or whatever. So, you know, he probably could have survived on pizza and Chinese food for kind of a long time.

Nic

Yeah. Yeah, I think that's right. As long as he's eating the Chinese food directly out of the container with a chopstick.

Steve

Yep, chopsticks. I've actually one of my biggest pet peeves about my favorite local Chinese food restaurant is that they serve their chow mein in a. When you get it to go, it's like in a shallow, wide box.

Nic

It's got to be in the classic box because you can't dig in that thing.

Steve

Yeah, I can't I can't. I can't hold it and eat it. Like I have to share with my family, which is just unacceptable. Yeah, very much.

Nic

You brought up the. The car stereo thing just because this kind of happened towards the end. But I just think it was so funny when Cliff, his kind of apology gift to Janet was, I put this sick new stereo in your car that could use so many other kinds of service or money invested into it. It's like that Pimp My Ride show, you know, where someone's like, oh, yeah, I gotta drive two hours a day to work and I have an 82 Peugeot. And exhibit's like, let's put an aquarium in the back. It's like, God damn it, man. Just getting me something reliable. My oil's leaking everywhere.

Steve

How about some anti lock brakes? How about that? How about an airbag?

Nic

How about a side mirror so I can see what's going on in the freeway? But the scene of the music playing as Chris Cornell watched, which was great. The music is so powerful that it just starts destroying the car. Took me back a little bit to the Breakfast Club with Emilio Estevez screaming inside of the record room at the best library I've ever seen in my life. And the wa. And the glass just shatters. I really like that.

Steve

Oh, man. Good stuff. So, yeah, I don't. So we know Cliff and Janet end up getting back together at the end because honestly, at this point, I didn't care. I'll be totally honest. But Cliff said, God bless you when she sneezed. So they get back together. Okay, great. So, you know, when all is said and done, you know, pretty much everybody's got it figured out. Debbie, we understand this was like the kind of exposition at the end that Cliff just throws at us, but Debbie apparently flew to Mexico through la. Specifically through la on first one to sit next to a single guy and they put him. They put her next to like, you know, a 14 year old or whatever he was.

Nic

Oh, that's right.

Steve

Right. But then she meets that kid's dad in Mexico and he wants her to move there, there for him, you know, whatever. She gets flowers or something. It's. It's a little silly, but yeah. So this is one of those movies where, you know, nothing's really all that different at the end from the beginning. And that's intentional. You know, it's a character study. It's a character driven film. It's not a plot driven film. But yeah, so it really gets the end. You're kind of like, I enjoyed it. I enjoy this movie. I mean, the music, the soundtrack alone. I will rewatch this movie just to hear the random snippets of State of Love and Trust and Nearly Lost you and little places in the background. I think the soundtrack's fantastic, but it's, you know, not a lot happens.

Nic

Yeah, it's definitely one of those. Where it kind of ends with. And that's what goes on in this crazy apartment complex that we live in.

Steve

Yeah. Speaking of living all together in the same apartment building are you aware of one of Cameron Crowe's beefs with Warner Brothers over this film?

Nic

No.

Steve

So this is fun. So Warner Brothers, when this was. I don't know if it was when it was being made, if it had been finished before it had been released, etc. Or maybe it was after was released. But they approached Crow about turning singles into a television show. And he did not want anything to do with. He's like, no, I'm not interested. I do movies. I don't do tv. So then later, Warner Brothers produces a little show called Friends. And Cameron Crow is convinced.

Nic

Oh.

Steve

That this is a direct ripoff of singles. And I read that before this rewatch, and I thought, he's crazy. It's just. It's a movie about kid. You know, people like, whatever you have around the same age. Sure. Like, whatever. But, you know, there's. That's where the similarities end. Yeah. No, no. Watching it with that in mind this time. Steve is Ross.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

Linda is Rachel, Cliff is Joey, Janet is Monica. Debbie's kind of Phoebe and Bailey's kind of nobody. But, like, there are some really significant character similarities between five of those characters. And I have a feeling if we had gotten more of Bailey, he would have been more of that Chandler kind of clown character.

Nic

On the pilot for Friends, Chandler had a ridiculous soul patch.

Steve

So, I mean, it's. It's.

Nic

So.

Steve

Yeah. I wonder if Cameron Crowe had a point now, as it turns out. So he, you know, approached either his legal team or tried to get lawyers to take it on. And they could not find enough, you know, evidence to make it worth actually filing suit. So they never did file a lawsuit. But I don't think he's that out of left field to say that Friends was directly inspired by this movie.

Nic

Yeah, that's very interesting. And, man, imagine if they had a little bit more grunge influence on the Friends. I mean, all due respect to the Rembrandts, but they didn't have the staying power of some of the bands in this movie. So maybe they could have used Cameron Crowe's artistic vision a little bit. I think that show ended up doing fine. I haven't looked into it. I think it. I think it did all right.

Steve

Yeah. I'm pretty sure nobody involved in creating or running it has any regrets or money problems at this point in their lives. So they're good. But yeah, but it really. Yeah, I think, you know, Cameron Crowe has got some amount of beef. Appropriate beef.

Nic

So what was the next thing Cameron Crow did after this? Was it Almost Famous?

Steve

You know what? It might have been. If you give me a second, I will find out.

Nic

Out. But because he's one. I was looking at a list of his films and I realized I haven't seen that many of them. Jerry Maguire I'd seen Almost Famous. I'd seen.

Steve

Right. And those are the two that I always think of. I mean, there's this Jerry Maguire, Almost Famous. Those are the ones I think of for him, you know, when I'm like, oh, like Cameron Crowe. So as a director. So he did. So Almost Famous was not until 2000. Oh, so he directed say Anything. That was his debut as a director. John Cusack film say Anything. So then. And that's what he did. Did to then kind of be able to make singles. So then. Yeah, Jerry Maguire was next in 1996 and then almost Famous and then Vanilla Sky. Oh, I saw Elizabethtown. That was okay.

Nic

That's a pretty good run for. For a few years.

Steve

We Bought a Zoo. So. Okay. But yeah, so no, say Anything was.

Nic

So this to Jerry Maguire. So they must have seen something because Jerry. Unless he also wrote Jerry Maguire, it seems like one of those movies that they would.

Steve

He did write it. Oh, he did.

Nic

Very nice. Okay, well, good for him. I mean, it's a totally different movie tonally and Jerry Maguire is kind of a classic. This is going to make a lot of money. There's big, you know, big people involved. Big blockbuster type movie.

Steve

It's a classic kind of rom com story with a huge star in the lead. So. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Nic

Good old Cameron Crow.

Steve

All right, so that is. That is singles, I think. Unless there's anything else on your list. I think we kind of covered my notes here.

Nic

I think. I think we can go through and rate this.

Steve

Why don't we let. As the person who saw it for the first time this time, why don't you get started? What do you end up giving us out of five?

Nic

Yeah. So I think this movie, again, kind of disjointed, but maybe intentionally so. It's not like A failed attempt at a narrow, at a classic narrative. It did its own thing. I like the uniqueness of the gags. I thought there were some legitimately really funny parts. Campbell Scott killed me. Yeah, I, I just didn't have a moment where I really cared about that character at all. And he wasn't enough of a bad, bad guy to really root against, so he was just kind of a dude. I think if there was somebody maybe better in that role, I would have enjoyed the movie a little bit more. But that being said, the music was cool. Just seeing a vision into what is Seattle in the early 90s that ended up influencing so much of our culture today. You know, I mean, Target is even super underground. They're selling Nirvana shirts. Sure. The state of Kurt Cobain loves that, right? So, yeah, I'm gonna give this movie a two and a half out of five.

Steve

Okay.

Nic

I think there was enough bits and pieces that it was enjoyable. Enjoyable to me, but overall, even when I'm thinking about it, it's hard for me to remember what happened with all these people because it wasn't quite as engaging as far as the plot lines and stuff. But great cameos, great music, great gags.

Steve

Yeah, totally fair. I, I, I'm only slightly more positive about this film. I'm going with a 3.0 out of 5 for myself. Again, very similar comments. I do think that the, the music, the, the view into the zeitgeist and everything, I think is what, for me bumps it a little higher. I think there's more value there for me in this movie. It really is the kind of thing where it's like, I could watch this movie just to, like, I wouldn't have to watch it. I could watch this movie and with headphones on without seeing a screen because the fact that, you know, the music will just come up at once, like I said, when, when, when Linda and Steve are just hanging out in Steve's apartment, screaming Trees is playing in the background. And, you know, I mean, it's little things like that. And it's really what, you know, what makes this movie, I think, is that it is a view into, like you said, the Seattle era, the early 90s, the Seattle Sound grunge, the Gen X. There's so much that this movie ended up mattering about when it comes to that stuff. So for me, it's a 3.0.3.0. For you, a 2.5, a 5.5. Probably a little low compared to the general populace's view of the film, but obviously we're in kind of the same ballpark with it. So not something that either of us adores, but again, not a bad film. It does feel like we're kind of in that ballpark with a lot of the movies that we're talking about together where it's like, you know, they're not bad.

Nic

Yeah.

Steve

But they're not great. So on that note, Nic, why don't you tell us what's the next movie we're gonna see?

Nic

Okay. The next hopeful. Not bad, not great. That we have coming up.

Steve

Up.

Nic

And this is one. I've been considering what to pick next. And I had kind of not like a heated conversation, but like a decent conversation with my wife about this movie today. And I thought, okay, this would be an interesting one for us to pick. This film is from 1990, and it stars Melanie Griffith, Matthew Modine, and Michael Keaton. 1990. I. I classify, if I'm giving it a title, what I refer to it to my wife, which started this conversation as a landlord thriller. And it's called Pacific Heights.

Steve

Okay.

Nic

It's very, very interesting kind of thriller. It takes place in San Francisco, which will be very fun, very nice to see, and I think it'll be a lot of fun to talk about.

Steve

All right. Another one I've never seen. So this is great. This is going to be fun. So seeing a pre.com San Francisco is always something.

Nic

Different world in different movies.

Steve

There's a few. I know, at least a couple more that I'm thinking of for later in this series that will do the same, but cool. So Pacific Heights. Pacific Heights, the next movie that we'll do. Yeah, that was singles and this is 2Dads1 movie. And thank you all so much for listening. I am Steve.

Nic

I'm Nic.

Steve

And thank you so much. We'll. We'll catch you next time.

Nic

Thanks, everyone.

Steve

Bye.